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 Anyone back from WAC show yet? UPDATE 
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todd1803 wrote:
misrepresented himself as an FFL, and had buyers complete 4473. He sh!tcanned the 4473's, represented as "proceed" and completed the deals.


I'm pretty sure this is frowned on... Maybe if there's an actual issue you should contact the ATF. Details are somewhat murky at this point so I'm hesitant to make any judgement as there's likely a lot of things we don't know.


Sun Apr 26, 2015 6:03 am
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Here is a list. If you buy one contact me and I'll give you the lawyers contact info.
Handguns;
Ruger .22 revolver, stag or ivory grips, she thought they were ivory, but look like stag in the pics. 9 1/2 inch barrel, blue finish, serial un known at this time. They could not find a serial anywhere on this one. She said it was one of the first guns he bought when they were first together.
Ruger P 85 9X19 Stainless, MKII, serial 30391944
AMT Back Up .380, stainless, serial A87827

Shotgun;
Savage Fox 20 gauge SXS , serial BSE 3005263

Rifles;
Remington 700 in monte carlo stock, Redfield scope, calibre 30-06, serial 13827
Ruger 10-22, stainless, laminate, Tasco Pronghorn scope, serial 236-03501
Winchester Modle 94, 30-30, serial 4543925

Ammo;
Numerous boxes of ammo in these calibres, in grey milk crates. She said there were about half a dozen crates and some cardboard boxes stacked to the top full.
Ammo calibres also iincluded .357/.22/9X19/.380/30-06/20 gauge/.25 ACP/.38 special

Each firearm is in excellent condition, judging from the condition of what was recovered and the rest of the house. His man cave looks like a surgery theater as does the garage. I've not ever known a man who was so anal about cleaning and organization.

If you run across any of these items, PM me and I'll put you in contact with her lawyer.

Edited to add;
She is not interested in going after any third party buyers, if you did by chance buy one she only wants to ensure the BGC was done, and you let us know who sold it to you and for what amount. She will go after the wog who scammed her.


Sun Apr 26, 2015 8:44 am
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I'm confused.. If a person bought them at a WAC or WK show, wouldn't a BGC have been done? I realize there was some vendor trading that went down, with no BGC's done.. But the ultimate end user, probably a non-vendor who bought it off of a table at a show, would have gone through a BGC.


Mon Apr 27, 2015 5:41 am
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True, but only if they were re-sold by vendors to the general public. From what I've been told the fake FFL wog sold them to his gun show buddies at Chehalis. No BGC was done at that time. Likely all of them will be moved at other shows to other vendors, or sold out of state by vendors who do out of state shows, thus avoiding the I-594 BGC.


Mon Apr 27, 2015 6:50 am
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Was WK notified of a fake FFL running a table? he should have rental information for all the vendors.


Tue Apr 28, 2015 5:28 am
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Massivedesign wrote:
Was WK notified of a fake FFL running a table? he should have rental information for all the vendors.

This guy is a regular vendor there, and has a regular table. He only represented himself as a FFL to the widow he scammed. He promised her all the firearms would be sold legally, and the BGC would be run on each buyer. Instead he sold them to the other vendors with no paperwork.


Tue Apr 28, 2015 7:05 am
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OK so what is the beef here? I read this thread and still can't figure out what you and the original owner are mad about....

Did this guy pay her for the guns? Did he not pay her enough (a consignment agreement)? or is she mad that the firearms will not be sold with a BCG being conducted?

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Tue Apr 28, 2015 7:52 am
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TINCANBANDIT wrote:
OK so what is the beef here? I read this thread and still can't figure out what you and the original owner are mad about....

Did this guy pay her for the guns? Did he not pay her enough (a consignment agreement)? or is she mad that the firearms will not be sold with a BCG being conducted?

He has sold all but a couple, which were.recovered. He has yet to pay her for anything he sold. And yes, she's pissed that he lied to her about being a FFL dealer. She wanted them transferred legally, per the existing law.
Her choices are to report then stolen and have him arrested, file a civil suit for recover of funds, or just let him get away with theft of four to six grand.
If this was your family member, what would you do?


Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:13 am
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You need to contact WAC Asap.

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Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:23 am
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If you already talked to the cops about this, knowing that she handed them to this guy willingly, do you think the cops are really going to file these as stolen? Sounds like a civil issue to me.

Did she violate 594 by giving him the guns? Is 'he told me he was an FFL' an affirmative defense to a violation of 594? What jeopardy is she in?

If she was my family member, I wouldn't have let it get this far, but I understand that this is water under the bridge. I think your best bet at this point is to chalk it up to experience. Press him for the cash, and forget about pressing anything criminally as (1) her complaint against him would be ignored by the police/prosecutor and (2) she opens herself up for trouble on her violation. I'd try to scare him into doing the right thing by letting him know that what he did was civilly and criminally a no-no, and maybe have a lawyer write him a letter.

If you know who he is, and he's a regular vendor at the shows, can you tell us who he is?


Tue Apr 28, 2015 9:58 am
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Stokes wrote:
If you already talked to the cops about this, knowing that she handed them to this guy willingly, do you think the cops are really going to file these as stolen? Sounds like a civil issue to me.

Did she violate 594 by giving him the guns? Is 'he told me he was an FFL' an affirmative defense to a violation of 594? What jeopardy is she in?

If she was my family member, I wouldn't have let it get this far, but I understand that this is water under the bridge. I think your best bet at this point is to chalk it up to experience. Press him for the cash, and forget about pressing anything criminally as (1) her complaint against him would be ignored by the police/prosecutor and (2) she opens herself up for trouble on her violation. I'd try to scare him into doing the right thing by letting him know that what he did was civilly and criminally a no-no, and maybe have a lawyer write him a letter.

If you know who he is, and he's a regular vendor at the shows, can you tell us who he is?


I do know him. Outing him here will do no good, he knows what he's done is illegal. I'm only involved because he claimed the transfers went through my FFL, who I work part time for, and we know we didn't do any for him. As far as her being in violation, she was assured that he was an FFL and would handle all the paper work for her, and that she had nothing to worry about. In short, he lied to obtain the guns, then lied again when asked about the money and paper work.
At this point, aside from the appraisal of the items, I'm not involved any more than a consultation with her attorney. He'll be carrying it on from there. None of this would've happened if her husband had good estate planning, and someone had been there before those wogs took the guns and ammo from her house.
I was hoping by starting this thread I'd warn any members to check the serials on anything they bought at this weekends show, and to perhaps give an example of what poor estate planning on our part can incur.


Tue Apr 28, 2015 11:46 am
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Threaten to turn his ass into WAC. They won't tolerate any illegal c garbage.

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Tue Apr 28, 2015 11:50 am
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I'm sympathetic to your position, but I hope you'd rethink your position. Leaving it up as the guns being a problem seems unreasonable to me. They weren't stolen, and whom ever has them now doesn't deserve the trouble of having to go thru a 'stolen gun' issue when they bought them in good faith.

And then... leaving the 'victimizer' out of the spotlight doesn't really do anything but protect him.

So the guys that don't deserve it are going to get the raw end, and the guy that does deserve is going to get shielded. I think it should be the other way around.


Tue Apr 28, 2015 12:16 pm
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Airborne Engineer wrote:
TINCANBANDIT wrote:
OK so what is the beef here? I read this thread and still can't figure out what you and the original owner are mad about....

Did this guy pay her for the guns? Did he not pay her enough (a consignment agreement)? or is she mad that the firearms will not be sold with a BCG being conducted?

He has sold all but a couple, which were.recovered. He has yet to pay her for anything he sold. And yes, she's pissed that he lied to her about being a FFL dealer. She wanted them transferred legally, per the existing law.
Her choices are to report then stolen and have him arrested, file a civil suit for recover of funds, or just let him get away with theft of four to six grand.
If this was your family member, what would you do?


I would post this SOB's name here and everywhere you can

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Actor portrayal, Action figures sold separately, You must be at least this tall to ride, Individual results may vary, Sales tax not included, All models are over 18 years of age, upon approval of credit, Quantities are limited while supplies last, Some restrictions apply, Not available with other offers, At participating locations only, Void where prohibited, Above terms subject to change without notice, Patent pending.


See my blog: http://tincanbandit.blogspot.com/


Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:38 pm
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TINCANBANDIT wrote:

I would post this SOB's name here and everywhere you can


THIS!

You are worried about the next person being ripped off AND WAC doesn't want a rip off seller at their shows.

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Tue Apr 28, 2015 4:49 pm
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