missing child = warrantless search ?

[ANZAC]

warrantless searches in the United States.

So a fire engine should get a parking ticket if they park in the street while putting out a fire?

If the police are looking for a child that is IN DANGER or AT RISK a warrant has nothing to do with it, NOTHING. With the caveat that if the child has been adducted by a serial killer, without the warrant they are in a world of hurt to admit any of the evidence.

It has everything to do with trespassing and what is public and what is private/controlled access.
Life and limb, keeping the peace are different from criminal investigations and collecting evidence.

My recollection so far is:
no controlled access (gate/fence) they can go in and look. Gate/fence they can't.
If they see the kid or hear the kid or other indication, they can go in, regardless of fence/gate/locked door.

[root]

warrantless searches in the United States.

So a fire engine should get a parking ticket if they park in the street while putting out a fire?

If the police are looking for a child that is IN DANGER or AT RISK a warrant has nothing to do with it, NOTHING. With the caveat that if the child has been adducted by a serial killer, without the warrant they are in a world of hurt to admit any of the evidence.

It has everything to do with trespassing and what is public and what is private/controlled access.
Life and limb, keeping the peace are different from criminal investigations and collecting evidence.

My recollection so far is:
no controlled access (gate/fence) they can go in and look. Gate/fence they can't.
If they see the kid or hear the kid or other indication, they can go in, regardless of fence/gate/locked door.

And this a good measure to go by. They need actual primary indication that the child is in there.

[AR15L]

You all have short memories:

[norahc]

You all have short memories:

Not all of us...

[Lew]

But...they apologized for the inconvenience!

[Old Jim]

As far as I am concerned, if access is requested, no problem. Without permission requested, and a closed gate and fence, they are welcome to set a perimeter and get a warrant, or enter and answer my attorney's questions.

[Soldier_Citizen]

Fuck that. My yard... It's locked not to keep me or my dog in... But you the fuck out... When I had a yard(live in an apartment now), if anyone, and I mean anyone entered my yard.... The whole neighborhood would know... I had an issue with someone trying to get into my truck, and into my garage.... After certain security devices where installed the problem stopped. And we all herd when it happened.

Also... You enter my locked yard and shoot my dog for being "vicious" aka doing her job of protecting my property and the well being of my family... You better hope your friends get to you before I do, because badge or not you shot my dog, you willfully destroyed my property... You better pray god has mercy on your soul cause I sure as fuck won't.

[TechnoWeenie]

You all have short memories:

Not at all.

It was a tipping point for me.

I genuinely believe I'm more likely to be assaulted by our gov't than by criminals.

[glockgirl]

Here are my thoughts. A missing child(mine, yours, neighbors) during an active investigation(report came to police and they are going door to door) not only would I allow them to search my property, I would hope they would investigate everyone's property in the immediate area even if the home owner was not home. Back yard, front yard and if the house is open then walk on in. I would not expect them to have a search warrant. I know of one resent case. Jacyee Dugard wishes someone would have taken the extra steps to investigate.

Do I feel(key word is feel) the same way about a wanted criminal? Not exactly. DUI suspect? Nope. It kind of ends there with me. Not a slippery slope. Not a "Well then what about" situation. Plain and simple. Kids trump rights in my opinion when missing.

Have you ever had your heart ripped out and no will to live? Try having your child go missing for 30 minutes and tell me how you feel.

This. There is a developmentally disabled child up the street from my house who frequently goes off on his own, despite security measures taken by his parents (door chimes, Door Guardian installed on all exterior doors, etc.). He is 10 now, and can cover a lot of ground in the space of a few minutes. Every time he lets himself out, and his mother calls me, it is like a kick in the gut. If there is a missing child, please, by all means, search my yard without my explicit permission. As Jaime points out, it's not a slippery slope--it's a special circumstance.

In this recent Detroit case, the argument is being made that the child was being held in another location the first few times the townhome was searched, including when it was being searched with cadaver dogs. I don't see any LEO failure in not finding a child who isn't there.

[MadPick]

Interesting discussion.

So, BadKarma and glockgirl . . . if there is a neighborhood child missing and you aren't at home, do you think it's acceptable for the police to:

- Enter your back yard if the gate is closed and simply latched?
- Cut the padlock on your gate to the back yard, if there is one?
- Break the front door of your house, if it's locked?

I'm genuinely curious.

Let's assume that they are just searching the neighborhood and don't have any specific information leading them to believe that the child is on YOUR property.

[BadKarma]

Interesting discussion.

So, BadKarma and glockgirl . . . if there is a neighborhood child missing and you aren't at home, do you think it's acceptable for the police to:

- Enter your back yard if the gate is closed and simply latched?
- Cut the padlock on your gate to the back yard, if there is one?
- Break the front door of your house, if it's locked?

I'm genuinely curious.

Let's assume that they are just searching the neighborhood and don't have any specific information leading them to believe that the child is on YOUR property.

Every situation is going to be very different. My yard is unlocked so by all means walk in. My house is locked but they can peek in and if they find an open window/door then yes. If I'm not there I would have no problem with them entering. Breaking down a door is over the line but if they see a kid/kidnapper/cause for concern I would not second guess their judgement.

Keep in mind, this is a very narrow scope for me. My kids life, and yours is you have any, trump just about anything in my opinion.

Now the case that is being brought up with the dog in Utah, that was a poor call on the cops part. He should have just backed out and left. He will pay for his actions along with the city.

[STED9R]

Dunno, may side a little with Badkarma an Glockgirl.
When mine were young an IF went missing, I would have had kicked doors down and dealt with consequences later all the while knowing that the safety of my child was more important than mine or the possibility of my freedom. And, would hope that other adults, whether Leo's or other grown adults had the same mindset. Mine are 23, 26 and 31 and to this day, nothing will stop me and I will not only sacrifice, but will do so without thinking at all of my own safety or freedom.
What if a neighbor took my child and ignored the knock on the door to finish what they started?
On the same page, if I'm in my home cooking up meth, fooling around with an under aged Craigslist queen or lubing up with Vaseline while watching reruns of Gilligans Island, I'm going to be more than pissed and standing on my gold plated soap box demanding my rights. Same goes if my dog gets shot.....but, I have nothing to hide and nothing to fear and, if by chance there is something that may be questionable, I know that the evidence is not admissible.
Now, look back and get out of tunnel vision and see how a drone could have prevented the death of a dog. While it doesn't cover an inside of a house, a simple pass over the backyard may have netted a kinky couple playing vet doctor, it would have also shown a dog and no kid in the yard which, would mean that the pet in question would still be alive.

[AR15L]

Dunno, may side a little with Badkarma an Glockgirl.
When mine were young an IF went missing, I would have had kicked doors down and dealt with consequences later all the while knowing that the safety of my child was more important than mine or the possibility of my freedom. And, would hope that other adults, whether Leo's or other grown adults had the same mindset. Mine are 23, 26 and 31 and to this day, nothing will stop me and I will not only sacrifice, but will do so without thinking at all of my own safety or freedom.
What if a neighbor took my child and ignored the knock on the door to finish what they started?
On the same page, if I'm in my home cooking up meth, fooling around with an under aged Craigslist queen or lubing up with Vaseline while watching reruns of Gilligans Island, I'm going to be more than pissed and standing on my gold plated soap box demanding my rights. Same goes if my dog gets shot.....but, I have nothing to hide and nothing to fear and, if by chance there is something that may be questionable, I know that the evidence is not admissible.
Now, look back and get out of tunnel vision and see how a drone could have prevented the death of a dog. While it doesn't cover an inside of a house, a simple pass over the backyard may have netted a kinky couple playing vet doctor, it would have also shown a dog and no kid in the yard which, would mean that the pet in question would still be alive.

That post was slightly disturbing.

[Mohawk13]

Interesting someone would pull Missing Kids in Israel into the argument.....And a missing kid does not trump the 4th Amendment...Anyone know why it was put into the Bill of Rights...May want to do some research. Emotion never trumps the Rights of Everyone...Period. Even the 11th Circuit Courts Decision on the 4th has been brought up for Judicial Review by SCOTUS.

I understand as a Father a missing child has dire implications in today's society. I fear for My kids safety, But I would never ask someone to give up a personal freedom to have Police stomping around peoples property to find them. I taught My Kids better than that and to never be a victim, let alone go with a stranger, and to always be aware of their surroundings...Basic parenting 101...to many folks rely on others to teach their children well...sad fact of today's society

Another question, "Was An Amber Alert issued in the case of this Child?"

[golddigger14s]

Let's clarify this "Drone" shit. The predator with Hellfires, that's a "Drone". The rest of the shit people are all up in arms about are fricking high priced toys.

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