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Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:10 pm
by mcyclonegt
So the story that has me pissed off today is about Tim McGraw. He is doing a benefit concert for the victims of Sandy Hook. All proceeds are going to a Organization called Sandy Hook Promise. Gun sites and bloggers have flipped shit and folks are using his CDs for target practice and swearing off listening to another one of his songs. Saying he is now anti gun. I can't for the life of me find anything that proves this group is anti gun. They are against gun violence, but aren't we all? Why is a group that is against gun violence labeled as being anti gun, right off the bat? By that logic, if we like guns, then we automatically are for gun violence. This shit is insane, we can sometimes be our own worst enemy. Unless someone can prove that this organization wants to take your guns away from you.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:15 pm
by never_to_much
Gun violence is a term made up to single out guns used in violent crime. It's a cover up like "assault weapon" hide the true image of what your for make it sound all nice warm and fuzzy.
Ie: If your for banning an ar 15 then by definition your a gun banner.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 2:39 pm
by Classic
McGraw is just a country fuck that I wont listen to or miss but his wife would do for a night or 2
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 3:25 pm
by oldkim
It's called "an agenda"
So by default... Yes an Anti-Gun Violence group is Anti-Gun. Their agenda is to rid society of all guns. Hence you stop gun violence by getting rid of the "tool" (e.g. the gun)... not really fixing the real issue of why folks are harming (causing violence) to begin with...
We are not pro Gun Violence because we like guns. Remember a gun laying on a table isn't going to jump up and shoot you or anyone.
violence -
Yes, I think we all agree we are against criminal violence. Where innocent victims are harmed. I say this as when gangs attack another gang (criminal vs criminal) then so long as they don't involve innocent bystanders... let them have at it.
As for Tim McGraw... he's being paid to perform.
If he was doing it for free then I would say he's personally backing their cause.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 6:10 pm
by TINCANBANDIT
"The media insists that crime is the major concern of the American public today. In this connection they generally push the point that a disarmed society would be a crime-free society. They will not accept the truth that if you take all the guns off the street you still will have a crime problem, whereas if you take the criminals off the street you cannot have a gun problem." - Col. Jeff Cooper
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:50 pm
by mcyclonegt
oldkim wrote:It's called "an agenda"
So by default... Yes an Anti-Gun Violence group is Anti-Gun. Their agenda is to rid society of all guns. Hence you stop gun violence by getting rid of the "tool" (e.g. the gun)... not really fixing the real issue of why folks are harming (causing violence) to begin with...
This can't be by default. What if a group has no desire at all to take away guns or create laws? What if all they want to do is educate and help prevent more violence. We all know that violence can be reduced without taking guns out of the picture. I can find nowhere that they want to rid society of guns. This is just an assumption on your part. Now if a person has proof that a group wants to infringe on our rights, then they are Anti-gun.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 8:54 pm
by CurtisLemansky
I have yet to see an anti-gun violence group that doesn't support gun control. Please feel free to point any out that aren't.
Sent from my UAV using Disposition Matrix 2.0
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 9:39 pm
by edogg
This Sandy Hook Promise group seems pretty benign when it comes to gun rights. At least according to their site:
http://www.sandyhookpromise.org/
Basically they look to be encouraging people to watch for signs of troubled people. And they have some steps to take if you think someone might harm themselves or someone else.
This is pretty common sense stuff too:
http://www.sandyhookpromise.org/keep_it_safe_and_secure
All of that said, there might be more under the surface. Check out this article, which talks about attempts to change laws:
http://www.brookings.edu/research/essay ... gun-safety
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Wed Apr 15, 2015 10:52 pm
by mcyclonegt
This is about as close to proof as I have found. Some of them were behind the huge gun law passed 3 months after Sandy Hook.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 4:06 am
by Pablo
Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Yes.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 7:31 am
by RusoArmo
Anti-Gun Violence = Anti-Gun. Every time.
Anti-Violence (regardless of tool used) can be debatable. Are they advocating that people stop killing each other? Or are they advocating people stop having guns, bats, knives, pipes, tooth picks, frying pans, cars and stuffed animals?
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:33 am
by oldkim
mcyclonegt wrote:oldkim wrote:It's called "an agenda"
So by default... Yes an Anti-Gun Violence group is Anti-Gun. Their agenda is to rid society of all guns. Hence you stop gun violence by getting rid of the "tool" (e.g. the gun)... not really fixing the real issue of why folks are harming (causing violence) to begin with...
This can't be by default. What if a group has no desire at all to take away guns or create laws? What if all they want to do is educate and help prevent more violence. We all know that violence can be reduced without taking guns out of the picture. I can find nowhere that they want to rid society of guns. This is just an assumption on your part. Now if a person has proof that a group wants to infringe on our rights, then they are Anti-gun.
Sorry to burst your bubble of happy perfect utopia... life doesn't work that way. This group may be so... but the bigger anti groups that any group will "join" forces with... is. So you can have a "poster" group that is "perfect" and they can be used as "pawns" for a much larger group that supports them... And their agenda is to rid all legal firearms.
Why legal firearms? Because the criminals are already breaking the laws so they are not going to follow another law.
Remember someone is always pulling the "strings." It's very rare to find an organization that can stand by itself.
So are you aware that this group has 2 groups? One is the foundation and an Action Fund. The action fund is to fund legislation... for "implementing sensible solutions..."
http://www.sandyhookpromise.org/terms_conditionsI wonder what that means?
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:41 am
by BadKarma
Rusoarmo wrote:Anti-Gun Violence = Anti-Gun. Every time.
Anti-Violence (regardless of tool used) can be debatable. Are they advocating that people stop killing each other? Or are they advocating people stop having guns, bats, knives, pipes, tooth picks, frying pans, cars and stuffed animals?
Yep. 100% of the Anti-Violence crowd is Anti-gun.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 8:56 am
by rstrobel
From the "Sandy Hook Promise" Facebook:
"OREGON: Great news out of Oregon where the State Senate just voted 17-13 for #SB941, to require background checks on all gun purchases"
regarding constitutional carry in Maine: "Since background checks are not required for private or online sales in Maine, the concealed carry permit application is sometimes the only way to catch buyers who should not have access to firearms and without it, police would be unaware of these situations. You can hear more of the police chiefs' concerns from the news conference at the link below."
"Background checks and child access prevention laws will ensure the safety of more Oregonians their children. These laws will help to keep firearms out of the hands of dangerously ill people and criminals, as well as out of the reach of children to prevent unintentional shooting deaths and injuries that have become much too frequent."
yuck "Sandy Hook Promise would like to send our condolences to the Brady family and everyone at the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence on the passing of Sarah Brady.
Sarah was the wife of former White House Press Secretary James Brady who was shot in the head during an assassination attempt on President Ronald Reagan. Four years after the shooting that partially paralyzed her husband, she became an activist fighting for common sense gun laws, universal background checks, and child safety.
Since the Brady Bill was passed in 1993, it has blocked an estimated 2 million prohibited gun purchases and helped save countless lives. Her efforts to prevent gun violence were tireless and she will be sorely missed."
They may not be openly pushing for gun bans, but they are definitely pro-UBC. That falls under "anti-gun" in my book.
Re: Are Anti gun violence groups automatically Anti-gun?
Posted: Thu Apr 16, 2015 9:06 am
by joao01
rstrobel wrote:From the "Sandy Hook Promise" Facebook:
"OREGON: Great news out of Oregon where the State Senate just voted 17-13 for #SB941, to require background checks on all gun purchases"
regarding constitutional carry in Maine: "Since background checks are not required for private or online sales in Maine, the concealed carry permit application is sometimes the only way to catch buyers who should not have access to firearms and without it, police would be unaware of these situations. You can hear more of the police chiefs' concerns from the news conference at the link below."
"Background checks and child access prevention laws will ensure the safety of more Oregonians their children. These laws will help to keep firearms out of the hands of dangerously ill people and criminals, as well as out of the reach of children to prevent unintentional shooting deaths and injuries that have become much too frequent."
yuck "Sandy Hook Promise would like to send our condolences to the Brady family and everyone at the Brady Campaign to Prevent Gun Violence on the passing of Sarah Brady.
Sarah was the wife of former White House Press Secretary James Brady who was shot in the head during an assassination attempt on President Ronald Reagan. Four years after the shooting that partially paralyzed her husband, she became an activist fighting for common sense gun laws, universal background checks, and child safety.
Since the Brady Bill was passed in 1993, it has blocked an estimated 2 million prohibited gun purchases and helped save countless lives. Her efforts to prevent gun violence were tireless and she will be sorely missed."
They may not be openly pushing for gun bans, but they are definitely pro-UBC. That falls under "anti-gun" in my book.
