GLOCK: Over-zealous marketing or Big Brother?

[wombat]

I couldn't see that this had been posted, so ...

Here's a fine upstanding example of a LGS standing up for privacy ... and an eye opener for other LGS owners ...

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http://www.tropgun.com/trop-response-to-glock-blue-label-program-termination/

Trop Response to Glock Blue Label Program Termination

Trop Gun Shop regrets to inform our customers that we will no longer be participating in the Glock Blue Label program. Effective immediately, Glock terminated us from the program for refusing to furnish access to our customers’ private information for the purposes of auditing by Glock employees. While it is regrettable that we will no longer be able to offer the benefits of the Blue Label program here at Trop, we absolutely refuse to compromise the sensitive information of our customers by furnishing it to anyone without proper authority through standard legal practices.

To participate in the Glock Blue Label program a dealer must allow Glock access to audit “qualifying credentials” of its Blue Label customers. Typically these credentials are a form of identification verifying the individual is a member of one of the groups listed in the Blue Label program.

Recently a representative of Glock entered our establishment and demanded access to view our records related to all Blue Label sales, specifically our ATF Form 4473s, which contain very detailed, personal and identifying information of our customers. We refused the Glock representative access to this information.

During repeated correspondence Glock continued to demand access to the 4473s or we would be terminated from the Blue Label program. We attempted to reconcile the situation while maintaining our customers’ privacy and made every effort to comply with reasonable requests to audit the Blue Label sales to maintain the integrity of the program. However, Glock insisted that access to the 4473s and only access to the 4473s would be a sufficient level of compliance.

Our position was, and continues to be, that we will not surrender to Glock our Form 4473s and our customers’ identifying information under any circumstance. It is an untenable breach of our customers’ privacy and Trop Gun Shop will not submit to this unreasonable demand. As a result of our position, Glock immediately terminated our status as an authorized participant of the Blue Label program. Furthermore, Glock advised us that if we ever applied in the future, that request would be denied. While we are displeased that we can no longer support our qualifying customers through the Blue Label program, Trop Gun Shop remains committed to the security and privacy of all of our customers, and continues to offer its Law Enforcement / Military discount to those who qualify.

Regards,

Trop Gun Shop

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Trop Gun Shop - Elizabeth Town, PA.
***

... would be worthwhile to spread this around on other sites ...

[kf7mjf]

They want to make sure their discounted guns are going to the people targeted for the discount. Not too unusual to have an audit requirement built into a special discount program.

[wombat]

... if Glock want to verify the bonafides of those purchasing under the Blue Label Program, demanding 4473's is not appropriate.

A separate Glock logo from for the purchaser, should be the practice, in addition to all other forms such as 4473's.
That Glock logo form to be shown to Glock, as a means to prove the purchaser is appropriately due for the discount.

Which I believe Glock is beginning to implement now.

[Mediumrarechicken]

Meh. Apparently people don't understand what an audit means? I'm sure the word audit is mentioned more than on e I. The contract they signed. Stupid

[Ops]

well it says they need to staple the certificate to the 4473.

so they want to verify they are eligible. sounds like they are trying to stir the pot since they couldnt follow the rules.

[joao01]

Meh


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[leitung]

When I bought blue label guns, I always had to fill out a form and sign after providing a copy of my credentials. I believed that a serial number and buyers info was present on that form. I figured thats how Glock (and others such as FN) kept track of the guns being sold in the programs. I would believe it would be reasonable for Glock or whoever to audit the paperwork.

[Massivedesign]

"Because of those Nazi Bastards from Glock, WE HAVE CHOSEN to no longer sell their discounted line!"..... "But you can still buy a wonderful, reliable Glock from us at normal, non-blue label pricing".


Sounds like somebody got busted for violating the Blue Label Contract... They are lucky they are still able to sell Glocks, period.

[Silent_Rites]

Glock is big brother!!


Everyone switch to Hi-point!

Ready, go!

[cycle61]

Glock is big brother!!


Everyone switch to Hi-point!

Ready, go!

You first.

[H2obouget]

Hmm...

A company who swears their guns always work....and have had numerous "unlisted" recalls, but has gone out of their way to cover them up...to the point of sueing people who have posted the recall lists.

Or
A company who says...if you break it...send it back we'll fix or replace it...no questions asked.

Which company do I have more respect for?

Hi points are fugly, but everyone who has had one says they run just fine.
Hell, that YouTube 888 guy reamed out a 40 carbine and ran freaking 10mm out of it. Not to mention what he did to that 9mm they beat the crap out of.
Mean while a Glock goes KaBoom and people act like it never happened.

For $585 I can buy one Glock or 3 Hi Points...
And at least Hi Point makes a freaking carbine! (I can buy 2 of those for my $585)

[stompah]

Like others my first thought is the don't want to share the info because there isn't any to share. I wouldn't be surprised if a lot of the blue label guns were sold retail and with only 2 mags.

[NWRed]

... if Glock want to verify the bonafides of those purchasing under the Blue Label Program, demanding 4473's is not appropriate.

A separate Glock logo from for the purchaser, should be the practice, in addition to all other forms such as 4473's.
That Glock logo form to be shown to Glock, as a means to prove the purchaser is appropriately due for the discount.

Which I believe Glock is beginning to implement now.

Lying on a Glock produced form carries no real penalty beyond losing your Blue Label dealer status. Lying on a 4473 is a felony. They're wanting the 4473s for the Blue Label pistols because that's got the name of the actual purchaser, not just some recycled info from a cop who purchased a Blue Label pistol from them 4 years ago, when the actual Glock in question was sold at over retail after Sandy Hook during the hype to someone who wasn't eligible by Glock's criteria for a Blue Label Glock.

[EMNofSeattle]

... if Glock want to verify the bonafides of those purchasing under the Blue Label Program, demanding 4473's is not appropriate.

A separate Glock logo from for the purchaser, should be the practice, in addition to all other forms such as 4473's.
That Glock logo form to be shown to Glock, as a means to prove the purchaser is appropriately due for the discount.

Which I believe Glock is beginning to implement now.

Lying on a Glock produced form carries no real penalty beyond losing your Blue Label dealer status. Lying on a 4473 is a felony. They're wanting the 4473s for the Blue Label pistols because that's got the name of the actual purchaser, not just some recycled info from a cop who purchased a Blue Label pistol from them 4 years ago, when the actual Glock in question was sold at over retail after Sandy Hook during the hype to someone who wasn't eligible by Glock's criteria for a Blue Label Glock.

I've never been asked if I'm a cop or judge or whatever on a 4473, besides glock can't prosecute you for lying on that form.

I didn't even know it was legal for dealers to hand out 4473s to private parties for their internal usage

[NWRed]

... if Glock want to verify the bonafides of those purchasing under the Blue Label Program, demanding 4473's is not appropriate.

A separate Glock logo from for the purchaser, should be the practice, in addition to all other forms such as 4473's.
That Glock logo form to be shown to Glock, as a means to prove the purchaser is appropriately due for the discount.

Which I believe Glock is beginning to implement now.

Lying on a Glock produced form carries no real penalty beyond losing your Blue Label dealer status. Lying on a 4473 is a felony. They're wanting the 4473s for the Blue Label pistols because that's got the name of the actual purchaser, not just some recycled info from a cop who purchased a Blue Label pistol from them 4 years ago, when the actual Glock in question was sold at over retail after Sandy Hook during the hype to someone who wasn't eligible by Glock's criteria for a Blue Label Glock.

I've never been asked if I'm a cop or judge or whatever on a 4473, besides glock can't prosecute you for lying on that form.

I didn't even know it was legal for dealers to hand out 4473s to private parties for their internal usage

Have you ever tried to purchase a LE Only program firearm? There's a form to be filled out besides the 4473. If you want an occupational discount, expect it to be subject to greater scrutiny compared to just paying retail and filling out a 4473.

Show me where in the Federal Register that an FFL is prohibited from showing anyone a 4473? Its not a tax document. FFLs are to maintain a copy until they go out of business, and then they are turned over to the ATF. Dont recall there ever being a secrecy clause in there however Im not an expert nor an FFL.

Did you really think I was saying Glock would be prosecuting anyone for lying a 4473? Really?
In all these Glock Blue Label threads the common theme seems to be people can't understand why Glock would want the 4473s.
Glock has a a seperate form for the qualifying credentials to be verified, in the case of .mil ID that cannot be photocopied the FFL signs that they verified the ID. You dont think that leaves the door wide open for misuse of the Blue Label program ?

Blue Label guns cost less then wholesale non-Blue Label guns, they cheaper then wholesale retail pricing and can only be sold per the contract (that the FFL agreed to abide by) to certain qualified purchasers. FFLs who then sells the Blue Label guns to non-Glock qualified purchasers at retail or near retail pricing are making more money. It's happened before and it'll continue to happen which is why they verify who is buying them.

I dont know if it comes into play with individual officer purchases, but "LE Only" firearms and ammo are Federal Excise Tax exempt, thats roughly 15% off that isn't paid to the Federal Govt by Glock.

The likliehood an FFL would lie about who's buying Blue Label Glocks from them is considerably higher then an FFL filling out 4473s with fraudulent info due to the possible penalties. Then penalty for lying to Glock is minimal and non criminal. The penalty for lying to the ATF is loss of your FFL and prison time. Glocks is double checking the info on the Glock forms against the info on the 4473s because the info on the 4473 is more likely to be correct and factual, versus the info on the Glock forms that could be entirely fabricated based on previous Blue Label customers who actually purchased 1 pistol using their LE discount but are reported to Glock as having purchased 3 or 4.

If an FFL was a Blue Label dealer for very long it'd be pretty easy to come up with a fill folder of photocopied credentials and FFL verified .mil IDs to reuse for LE program pistols that were sold to non-Glock qualified customers at slightly disounted retail prices netting the FFL a much larger profit.