Is anyone really surprised? They are blinded by their own ignorance.

I hate the radical anti-2A positions as much as the next guy, but this is wild hyperbole. PMB is right...contending this is what most Democrats want only weakens your own position. Let's not stoop to the level of our opponents by employing strawman arguments; we're better than that.

I do not conflate ignorance and apathy with malice. There is a profound difference.

Saying directly that the main body of people who vote D want to see all gun owners dead is purely hyperbole. It is the kind of rhetoric that is easily beaten in a debate, and therefore to use it to bolster a pro-2A position puts 2A in a losing position.

Besides that, it's silly.

As we're being killed should we take comfort that it wasn't "intentional?"

https://www.thenewamerican.com/usnews/c ... ation-raid

Like I stated in another thread. We HAVE to stoop to their level or we will never get anywhere. This, "we're better than that" is getting old. If they start to drown then we need to stuff a garden hose in their mouth to help them out.

I stand by my statement that they are simply just ignorant, and I'll even add delusional into the mix.

Tell that to Gary Willis and his family.

FYI
https://www.baltimoresun.com/news/maryland/crime/bs-md-aa-shooting-20181105-story.html

We must never let the end justify the means, no matter how tempting it may be at times. We have to maintain the moral high ground, difficult as that may be.


So one law-abiding gun owner is killed in an ERPO firearm seizure, and now suddenly we're all going to be killed? Come on, man...don't you realize how ridiculous that sounds? It's like the Black Lives Matter crowd pointing to a single incident of an unarmed black man being wrongly killed by police and then extrapolating that into "the police are out to kill black men". It's intellectually dishonest, and frankly, ridiculous. You're not going to reach the opposition and change any minds with that kind of "reasoning".

Should we wait until we start getting killed in larger numbers? What's your threshold of acceptable dead before we acknowledge the legal machinery already set up to murder us is doing its job?

Yes, we should wait - because ONE incident gone south (no disrespect to the man who lost his life, or to his family) is not a harbinger of the next holocaust. Let's fight these ERPOs using constitutional arguments, not fear-mongering. Anyway, you clearly don't seem to be able to dial back the rhetoric on this topic, so I'm done trying to get through.

Actually I'm perfectly calm here and not spending my time dissecting your rhetoric.

I'm still willing to discuss this. I'm pointing out that, despite the lip service paid by the dems that they "respect the 2nd Amendment but...," they are actively passing laws which are being used and will be used to murder gun owners. Pointing out these facts does not make me an extremist or someone to be dismissed.

Gary Willis was not the only casualty. There are many others going back many years.

Since you answered my question but wouldn't specify a threshold, I would like to ask what your specific numeric threshold of innocent gun owners murdered is before recognition of existing laws and attempted legislation in the pipe right now occurs? I say this with all possible respect and have no desire for an online pissing match.

State pistol registry only applies to mere mortals that do not have a federal firearms license.

We've talked (and disagreed) about the usage of words more than the danger.
Intent matters. Apathy and ignorance and wishful thinking do count as factors. Agreed?

Here's what you said earlier in this thread :


I responded that it is very easy to defeat this position in a debate, and do not be offended that I will now try to do so. We're on the same team... I dislike my team having an easily beaten "position." That's why I am doing this, not to be a dick or to belabor a point.

When "The People" vote for laws and representatives who espouse "safe food" laws, do they do so 'literally wanting people who sell raw milk and cheese to be murdered'?
Do people think this deeply when they pass a "No straws inside the city limits" law or rule? Do they want people who continue to use plastic bags instead of paper bags to literally be murdered?

Police Raid Organic Grocery Store with Guns Drawn

Fair points, I look at it the same way, I also view us as being on the same team and I don't want my team to be complicit in our own destruction by sugarcoating and denying our enemy's actions.


Do I think that all democrats spend day and night dreaming of ways to kill us?
No, but we have to face facts:
Their POTUS candidate wanted to do a national confiscation of common semi-autos.
Their party pushes unconstitutional EPRO laws everywhere.
Here in WA the democrats promise to confiscate all commonly owned semi autos across the largest city and county in the state if preemption is repealed.
They have proposed legislation to do annual random house searches of gun owners.
There is a state pistol registry which they can and will use as a basis for rounding up guns and no doubt if/when people resist this unconstitutional confiscation they will result in using deadly force.

This right here sums up what we're all dancing around:
http://www.spokesman.com/stories/2014/d ... mrap-goes/
https://www.foxnews.com/politics/nc-she ... dead-hands
https://www.syracuse.com/news/index.ssf ... death.html