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 United Parcel Service is terminating the accounts of gun.... 
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SFCRMSA wrote:
dreadi wrote:
NWGunner wrote:
dreadi wrote:
MadPick wrote:
dreadi wrote:
MadPick wrote:
How is this going to work now when you have a gun that needs to be sent back to the manufacturer for warranty work? Or you want to send a gun to a gunsmith?

This is a HUGE issue for the average gun owner.
Manufacturer can send you a label. A smith with a proper UPS account can do the same.


Yes, and the label says "from me" and "to FFL." But it's still me, a non-FFL, shipping the gun.
The label can say from FFL and to FFL, if the FFL creates the label correctly and you handing it to a driver does not make you the shipper.



It’s only because you’re an FFL that you don’t see any problems with this, and other things in this thread.
Do not presume to know anything about me. You do not know me.


I know you are nice guy, and we have never met. :thumbsup2: I mean you get to play with guns for a living, you got a sharp looking dog, your wife looks way better than you...
Nothing but love for you man. Well you do drive a Ford truck, so you ain't perfect. :bigsmile:
Thank you!

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:06 pm
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dreadi wrote:
Post Office still accepts long guns from non licensees.


Yes, they do . . . which does us absolutely no good if it's a handgun that needs to be shipped. And with UPS and FedEx already lost, and USPS the most traditionally anti-gun of the three (no ammo, no handguns for non-FFLs), it probably won't be long before we lose USPS for long guns as well.

I'm really surprised that the FFLs in this thread don't seem to even care about this topic. Yeah, you guys are good, but I'm surprised that you aren't showing even the tiniest bit of concern for the rest of us, or any condemnation for the policy change.

Remember that there is also a war on kitchen table FFLs at the moment, so we could all be in the same boat at some point.

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:12 pm
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MadPick wrote:

I'm really surprised that the FFLs in this thread don't seem to even care about this topic. Yeah, you guys are good, but I'm surprised that you aren't showing even the tiniest bit of concern for the rest of us, or any condemnation for the policy change.......


Pretty big assumption my friend.
Just because we don't come on here to rant and rave sure as hell doesn't mean we don't care.

But feel free to carry on.

As someone said earlier in this thread that they have "learned a lot about certain people"......The same is true for me and dare I say dreadi.

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Last edited by Nitro_Guns on Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:30 pm, edited 2 times in total.



Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:18 pm
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usrifle wrote:
dreadi wrote:
MadPick wrote:
cmica wrote:
Just go see Dana and he can do it :wink05:


So in this theoretical situation, let's say that I need to send a gun back to the manufacturer for repair. I take it to Dana, he ships it to the manufacturer for me. So now:

- Will the manufacturer ship it straight back to me, like they have in the past? I'm guessing not, since they didn't receive it from me. They'll send it back to Dana.
- Once Dana receives it, will he give the gun straight back to me? Or will I need to go through the background check process to get my own gun back?

I know that a gunsmith will give you your gun back without a background check, if they receive it from you. But that's not really the case here.
I personally have spoken to the ATF about this.
Yes, if FFL A acquires a firearm from a non licensee and disposes of it to FFL B for service, FFL A can dispose of it back to the non licensee without facilitating or conducting a background check.


The problem with that is, I still have to use an FFL to send my Firearm for repair (to an FFL) and then it's returned to the noted first FFL.
No BGC to get it back? Yeah,but it's gonna cost money unless you decide to offer the service for free.
I understand that you don’t like it. Steve asked a question and I answered it.

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:18 pm
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MadPick wrote:
dreadi wrote:
Post Office still accepts long guns from non licensees.


Yes, they do . . . which does us absolutely no good if it's a handgun that needs to be shipped. And with UPS and FedEx already lost, and USPS the most traditionally anti-gun of the three (no ammo, no handguns for non-FFLs), it probably won't be long before we lose USPS for long guns as well.

I'm really surprised that the FFLs in this thread don't seem to even care about this topic. Yeah, you guys are good, but I'm surprised that you aren't showing even the tiniest bit of concern for the rest of us, or any condemnation for the policy change.

Remember that there is also a war on kitchen table FFLs at the moment, so we could all be in the same boat at some point.
Seriously? You want me to show empathy here? Why is that important you? Why can I not just offer facts and solutions?

I know that you know that I show my face and name, and speak at nearly every session for the past 3-4 years. I am on the record…Face and Name…painting a target on my back. Yet, my lack of empathetic words here is problem for you? That’s really messed up.

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:29 pm
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Dana, back at the beginning of this thread there were a bunch of people with concerns. "We heard that UPS is doing this, apparently they did that, so-and-so heard this...". What I kept hearing from the FFLs at that point was, "well, it's still working fine for me, I don't see a problem." Yeah, that was kinda cold.

I didn't chime in that point; we really didn't know what going on with UPS and FedEx, so I wanted to wait for some facts.

Now that we have facts in hand, and they have officially changed their policies to shut out non-FFLs . . . yeah, I would hope that every one of us would show some concern. Even if the current rule doesn't affect some of us, it's a continuation of very bad things that are happening in this country, and possibly a sign of more bad things to come.

The next step for them may very well be, "we don't ship guns at all." At that point, we are all pretty fucked.

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 8:36 pm
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How is it that citizens are required to undergo background checks, brokered through FF licensees but any high school drop out, of (laregly) unknown reputation, can don a brown shirt and shorts and run around town... and across state lines... unfettered, unlicensed and unvetted, with van loads of firearms?

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 9:15 pm
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[quote="jukk0u"]How is it that citizens are required to undergo background checks, brokered through FF licensees but any high school drop out, of (laregly) unknown reputation, can don a brown shirt and shorts and run around town... and across state lines... unfettered, unlicensed and unvetted, with van loads of firearms?[/quote]


The people wearing the brown shirt's and shorts don't concern me, the ATF and the government does.
While the ATF changes laws all on their own, the Shippers react.
Do they really have a choice? If they didn't comply, the Feds would have a foot on their neck immediately. This is how you fold the house of cards.

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 9:56 pm
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MadPick wrote:
Dana, back at the beginning of this thread there were a bunch of people with concerns. "We heard that UPS is doing this, apparently they did that, so-and-so heard this...". What I kept hearing from the FFLs at that point was, "well, it's still working fine for me, I don't see a problem." Yeah, that was kinda cold.

I didn't chime in that point; we really didn't know what going on with UPS and FedEx, so I wanted to wait for some facts.

Now that we have facts in hand, and they have officially changed their policies to shut out non-FFLs . . . yeah, I would hope that every one of us would show some concern. Even if the current rule doesn't affect some of us, it's a continuation of very bad things that are happening in this country, and possibly a sign of more bad things to come.

The next step for them may very well be, "we don't ship guns at all." At that point, we are all pretty fucked.
I’m not sorry that I don’t use my time to express empathy in this matter and have used my energy for saying what I said.

The policy changes of UPS does affect every FFL that has an account with them. It changes the way we do business with them, it creates more work for us to do business with them. We just aren’t here ranting about it. Instead we gave a small window into what we were experiencing…we…the local guys, who come here and participate. Not some other entity far off, not some posts from other people that most of us probably don’t know who may or may not be telling the truth. Yet, we get flamed for stating how it was not affecting us. We weren’t driving the hysteria machine, so we get flamed. That’s messed up.

Every non licensee that reads this thread and needs to ship a gun can now read something other than rants and opinions, and now maybe can glean some facts on how they can get done what they need to do. Is that not OK?

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Sat Sep 03, 2022 10:11 pm
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https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/articl ... g-act.html
FedEx delivery network is 'on brink of COLLAPSE' because rising costs have pushed contractors to brink of bankruptcy, owner of delivery truck fleet warns

My Fedex/UPS drivers often use (from what it seems) non company vehicles, but rental vehicles.

What is going on with shippers?


Sun Sep 04, 2022 4:24 am
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Another update: https://www.ammoland.com/2022/09/ups-th ... n-industry

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Read more: https://www.ammoland.com/2022/09/ups-th ... z7eQr04uhG
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Sellers who do not ship at least 350 handguns a week risk losing their shipping accounts. Under the new agreement, UPS is only required to give customers a ten-day notice before cutting them off from the shipping service. The volume necessary means that most online retailers and manufacturers are now cut off from shipping guns through the carrier unless the handgun is shipped using the expensive Next Day Air service.

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Fri Sep 09, 2022 2:23 pm
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Sellers who do not ship at least 350 handguns a week risk losing their shipping accounts.

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Fri Sep 09, 2022 2:32 pm
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A new UPS client agreement seeks open access to gun dealers books and customer information.

UPS, it would seem, seeks to become a quasi-LEO.

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https://www.ammoland.com/2022/10/new-up ... L_CAMPAIGN)

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Thu Oct 13, 2022 6:46 am
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Whatever, fuck their idiotic bullshit, I just received gun parts via Yoo Pee Ess as recently as a week ago (and yeah, the company that was the sender clearly has the word "armory" in their name), so who knows what the deal is.

They'd go completely bankrupt if they actually went through with all the nonsense they've been putting out lately.

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Thu Oct 13, 2022 8:22 pm
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jukk0u wrote:
A new UPS client agreement seeks open access to gun dealers books and customer information.

UPS, it would seem, seeks to become a quasi-LEO.

Image

https://www.ammoland.com/2022/10/new-up ... L_CAMPAIGN)


How much you wanna bet the federal government is giving UPS money to behave like another three letter agency? UPS went to hell the instant they named a new CEO from outside the company, who is woke as fuck. The company has been on a rapid slide into the shit-abyss since.

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Thu Oct 13, 2022 9:30 pm
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