I went to the 12/3 Bothell OC Event at Lyon's Den Coffee, and I took my Dad's 1930 Broom-handle Mauser to the meeting, I would like to know your thoughts on taking Classic Guns to OC Events. Do these Collectibles properly represent the OC message, or is it considered showing off?

The Bulk of the collection is Classic guns, I only have very few Modern Handguns. and the Broom-Handle is the only gun I have that has a decent(And Comfortable) holster for it.

Thanks Guys(and Gals)!

~Robert

If you can effectively fire it, hit your target with a high degree of accuracy and feel comfortable shooting it in a high stress environment then carry on. Even if you CC, the basics apply.

+1. OC is about awareness. It's about educating people that people carry guns. That even though it a serious responsibility, people shouldn't fear law abiding people who decide to OC.

Agree with the comments above . . . with that said, my vote is that OC'ing a Broomhandle is not appropriate in a setting like that. I don't think it's an appropriate carry gun (not what you would choose to carry for self-defense), and I think in a public setting like that it could be viewed as kind of "gunslinger flamboyant."

We had a Second Amendment rally now at the grounds of the Capitol Building in Olympia some months back, sponsored by OCDO, and there was some serious "bling" being OC'd there, including long guns. In my mind that's a little different -- it's an organized event with primarily gun people, rather than an informal meeting of friends in a public restaurant.

Just my two cents . . . .

I'm going to make one additional point before this topic gets flooded with opinions.

You can carry what you want(with in the law). If I chose to freeze a beef stick or salami and carry it then so be it. Knife, slapjack, gun, taser, pepper spray. It really doesn't matter what other people think. It is what you feel comfortable in carring "In the OPEN" and if you feel it provides a level of protection that you feel comfortable with.

Just like driving an easter egg car(Prius, Smart Car, Metro...), you need to expect comments or critisim. If your thick skinned and comfortable with your choice then it shouldn't be a problem. People critisize Glocks for lack of safeties, 1911's for being too heavy and lack of capacity, XDs for being a plastic gun... The list goes on.

I completely agree that legally, anything can be carried.

But then, one of the missions of the OC community (and all of us) is to improve public acceptance of OC'ing and of firearms in general. Threads like this are a good discussion of the best way to accomplish that goal.

The only downside I see to this would be the tendency to show it to those that ask. Open carrying is one thing but it wouldn't help the cause if it's taken out of the holster and "shown around".

There are those that like to call attention to their openly carrying a firearm by carrying them in fancy tooled holsters. Also having unique grips with all kinds of art or inlays on them. And then there are those like myself that would prefer merely to carry in a holster selected merely for it's ability to hold the firearm in a manner that is unobtrusive yet ready when needed. I prefer a black pistol, not because of it's "tacticool" appearance but the fact that it tends to be less noticeable than the polished stainless, nickel plated, engraved, gold inlayed, "Barbeque Guns" that some prefer but that's my choice.


Whatever one chooses to carry, and the manner they choose, always take into consideration that others may not view it the same and might see it as more of a threat than you do. THAT's when the fun starts and usually ends with a negative view by the public in general.

All great comments!!

This is a great point. I asked FMJ at the event what he was carrying. He swiftly brought the holster around but did not unsnap the flap(I was watching him since it was one of his first OC events and I have never met him before). He did great and didn't break the cardnial rule, when OCing it is not time for "Show and Tell". It stays put unless you intend to use it.

Thanks for your thoughts guys!

I'd also like to point out that the Broom-Handle Mauser that I have could be considered "Plain". It's just a blued gun with dark walnut grips. Nothing more. The Holster appears to be for the Chinese version of the Broom-Handle, and is simply Tan leather with Steel snap caps on the pockets. I don't like handling any guns in public(except at a gun store or gun range), so I have always agreed to the "It stays in the holster" Rule. Those guns are also very valuable, so I prefer to keep it safely locked in the holster.

I can shoot it good at short range(7-10 Yds). And mechanically speaking, it's still in excellent shape! I am confident that if I ever had to defend myself, the Broom-Handle would work just fine. (They were used in two World Wars ya know)

And Since I'm a Military weapon collector, I also feel carrying classics can, in a way, pay homage to those that have fought in past conflicts. That's just my Opinion anyway.

Here's some food for thought: The Walther PP/PPK series is Technically a "Military Weapon" and/or a Collectible, and yet it's still a great carry gun, even though its been around since the 1920's.

Dude... if I had a C96 I'd OC it in a heartbeat. My Tokarev gets a lot of OC duty in the winter because I have a full flap holster for it. Same with a Nagant revolver when I bother keeping one around. I've also OC'd both in plain holsters. Why? Because I like the gun. It's comfortable for me and I can hit what I'm aiming at with them. I say if you have a handgun, OC it if you want. I've OC'd a MAC 11 with a ten round mag in it too. Why? Because I liked the damn gun. I went through a period where I CC'd it on a single point sling under my coat. Why? Because I liked the damn gun and the setup. Personally, I think a C96 Mauser is a great carry piece. It's easy in the hands, ten rounds of 7.63 Mauser is nothing to sneeze at, and you can reload with a stripper clip pretty dang fast. So why not?

I'm with Steve on this one.

I see two key goals in these events:

• Reduce the public's perceived threat of armed citizens. This is best done by maintaining a semblance of maturity and responsibility.
• Inform the public of the benefits of responsible armed citizens. We are not only protecting ourselves, our presence makes it safer for the sheep because the wolves are less sure who is a sheep and who is a sheepdog.

One of the most common tactics of the anti-gunners is to instill a fear in the public that armed citizens means a return to the "Wild West". Carrying a classic gun of the old west only serves to give them ammunition. Certainly, we know the difference and appreciate the old classics, but we need to remember that the anti-gunners will use that same image to undermine what we're trying to accomplish.

The concept is to convey the idea that carrying a gun is normal - something that ordinary, respectable law abiding citizens do.

OTOH, if I had an opportunity to attend an OC event I would probably wear a good looking gun in a good looking holster - no Glocks or Kydex. Stainless, wood and leather. It doesn't have to be flashy - understated elegance is my preference.

The rich wood of the Dan Wesson CCO in a simple Wilson Combat 'Practical' holster or either the Sig P226 Elite or P232 in their Galco pancake holsters. Stylish, yet simple and discrete.



The Dan Wesson looks so good, I kind of wish I hadn't sold it.

^^ Agreed, those are nice-looking OC setups.

I don't OC, but that type of setup is EXACTLY the image I would want to have.

I think one can carry an old school gun without that wild west impression. As a wheel gunner, I don't think twice about wearing a long barrel six shooter and double speed loader pouch if that's what I want to wear. At what point does something become "wild west "?

It is not a case of whether it IS wild west or not. What is important is the public's perception.

The public has been conned by the press, with the help of the government, into thinking that "guns are the problem" and that people that like guns are "gun fanatics".

The truth is that a large percentage of the population owns guns. Normal, law abiding folks just like you and I. One of the things that I've learned about dealing with folks that have strong opinions about something, yet are completely ignorant on the issue, is that it is a huge mistake to try to educate them forcefully or by presenting extreme examples. 'Tis much better to maintain an appearance of normal - to be right in the center instead of on the far end.

Appearances count. Not just a little, but a whole lot.

In other words, when I go to California to visit my family, I take two pistols. Not just any pistols, but good looking all stainless pistols. Like the Kahr K9 and the Sig P226 Elite. I leave the black guns at home like M&P 40L, the Kahr PM40, etc. The stainless guns with polished wood grips just don't have that "gangsta" image.

I've got no problem with a snubby 38 or something like my 4" 686 as an OC gun, but I wouldn't OC a 6" 686 and certainly not a hand cannon like the 500. Even if the individuals you see that see you seem to be OK with it, there's that good chance that some clown from the press is going to show up for interviews and a photo op. We know the press is not going to publish an unbiased story if they have half a chance to publish something juicy. A photo of someone carrying a long barreled revolver feeds right into their BS that carrying leads right back to the old west.

OTOH, if the participants are normal folks, including a fair number of professionals, that are carrying handsome yet discrete guns in holsters that resemble what they've seen detectives wear on TV, then the IMAGE will be positive.

Beating the 2nd Amendment drum rings hollow with the general public, just like most ecologists beating the do-right drum. People are selfish and self-centered more than they'll admit. They're interested in what is important to them. Most folks would like the streams and forests to be healthy for fish and wildlife, but when it comes to taxes, or regulations on emissions, or . . . they just don't see the point. They go down to their local park and the stream looks nice and pretty. They're clueless about how a pretty stream can be sick-sick-sick. Drain the swamp and put in a new mall that provides jobs makes a lot more sense.

The same is true on the gun control front. Since most folks don't own guns, the 2nd Amendment is a non-starter for them. It just doesn't matter. The Volunteer Army might have better rah-rah support from the public than the Army had back in the Vietnam days, but the lack of a draft means that a much smaller percentage of the public has had any personal experience with the military than my generation or the Greatest Generation before. As a result, they have zero experience with the realities of the military. The sacrifices of the service member. The sacrifices of the family. And that personal experience with weapons.

There IS a difference between the ism of the typical citizen and that of the veteran. The ism of the vet has a greater depth. Partially because of the brotherhood, but also because the vet actually put their ass on the line. Nothing intellectual about that.

When I first entered the military in November 1966, ism wasn't on my mind at all. Not that I had anything against it, it was just that things like a career and maybe a family in the future were my concerns. The service was something I did because the wasn't a good alternative at the time. About 5-7 years later I had a conscious realization that I was doing my part to protect ALL of the rights the citizens of the USA enjoy. Not just the rights *I* enjoyed, nor just the opinions and stuff that I agreed with. I protected the right to freedom.

Freedom is poorly understood and all too often under-valued. How can anyone that hasn't had a real taste of the price of freedom or the consequences of not having it understand it or appreciate it?

Most folks are sheep. Basic fact of life. Sheep are easily spooked; they're easily scared by the flagrant scare tactics of the anti-gunners. It is an emotional thing for them and they don't need to know anything about it to be scared. The government statistics are designed to be useful for politicians and bureaucrats to paint a picture showing how wonderful a job they are doing. There is no way the government is going to publish statistics that can be readily interpreted as showing that the police can't protect the public - that would be instant political suicide. The other accomplice is the press. The press is business. They are in the business of making money, mostly through advertising. They sell advertising according to how many people read or watch. So, the underlying objective is to get more people to read or watch you than your competitor. Easy. Excitement for the armchair crowd. Say stuff that get people excited - good or bad. Have more graphic photos and videos.

For example, there were two mass shootings a few months ago. One guy shot 6-7 people with something, while some other guy halfway across the country shot 5 people with an AK-47. Guess which made the bigger story? The story with the guy and the AK-47 got top billing; a big headline and a half page. Down at the bottom of the same page was a small article on the guy that shot more people. But, since he didn't use the badass AK-47, the story was too boring.

Bottom line? We need to understand where the buttons are for the general public. Don't push the buttons that scare them AND don't do little things that can be misinterpreted or used out of context. Find ways to inform them how they can benefit from our cause. If we can't communicate a real benefit to them, we will lose in the long run.

OK, I guess I'll step down from the podium now.