btw I think this is a good topic.

So do I. Let's try it again.

Some of you will say “I’d just shoot him.” Not so fast. In general, using deadly force requires that a reasonable person be in fear of serious injury or death. It’s going to be tough to show that pepper spray was a lethal weapon used against you when almost every police department in the country places the use of pepper spray at the LOWEST level on the use of force continuum. In most police agencies, you are required to pepper spray a resisting subject (if feasible) before you even consider using strikes against him. Pepper spray sucks. I know. I’ve been exposed to it over 50 times in training and on the street. It causes a lot of pain and some temporary blindness, but it doesn’t cause serious injury.

The standard argument I get from the “I’d just shoot him” crowd is that if the victim is disabled by the pepper spray, the criminal could disarm the victim and shoot him with his own gun. It’s a roundabout argument for justifying a deadly force response, but it doesn’t always work. In my opinion, if a criminal was using pepper spray and attempting to disarm his victim, it likely WOULD justify a lethal response. The problem is that the criminal actually has to be trying to take the gun for the victim to fear for his life. We need reasonable, articulable facts that would lead a person in a similar situation to believe that a disarming attempt was immanent. Mere possibility of an event happening isn’t enough evidence to keep you out of jail.

Example #1
You have your phone ripped from your hand or taken off the table while having coffee. You are lucky enough to trip/catch/whatever the BG. You begin to beat the crap out of him/her. They give up. You are now sitting on them, calling 911.

Example #2
Same as above only you pull your gun and are now holding them at gunpoint until the po po show up.

What will happen to you in both cases?

(BTW, you never 'touched' them... they tripped)

there's been quite a few cases that i could cite in seattle of hoodrats using pepper spray and attacking folks.

a spray for a spray.

I'm just trying to figure how this has anything to do with the use of pepper spray?

The use of pepper spray is becoming more common for BG's. It's legal to buy at stores and online (easy to get) and easy to use and hide.
Stuns and instantly works to subdue people.

As for spray for spray... childish. As if someone pepper spraying you... there is a negative reason for this to happen. Meaning the BG is NOT there as your friend... as a joke.



If you carry you should consider other alternatives to returning spray for spray.

Example #1
You have your phone ripped from your hand after being sprayed. You are lucky enough to trip/catch/whatever the BG. You begin to beat the crap out of him/her. They give up. You are now sitting on them, calling 911.

Example #2
Same as above only you pull your gun and are now holding them at gunpoint until the po po show up.

What will happen to you in both cases?

(BTW, you never 'touched' them... they tripped)

I am still not following the spray connection. Other than that your eyes are going to be burning in both of your scenarios.

Holding someone at gunpoint until LE arrives is a terribly dangerous thing to have to do... The Good Guy is in danger of being mistaken for a Bad Guy- it's happened.

From my layman's understanding, you are justified in holding the bad guy at gunpoint... I'd feel a little safer if I had been having lunch with SpikedZombies and he was the one sitting on the perp.

Send one of mine to the hostipal... I'll send one of yours to the morgue.

Don't bring pepper spray to a gun fight.

Having been pepper sprayed, and know how it feels, and the affects of it:
If you fucking spray me... I swear to god I will do everything in my power to fucking put you out of the fight, including ending ones life if needed.

Spraying me is an attack on me, with intent to do harm, if you intend to do me harm, I have the right to defend myself. And I will do such, as quickly as fucking possible.