At a couple of classes the advice I have been given is to (when handing over license and proof of insurance) is to say "I also have a concealed pistol license" and then let the officer decide if he wants to ask if you are carrying, i.e. give him the choice rather than forcing it on him.

The alternative exclamation "I HAVE A GUN" apparently doesn't work as well.

That last line literally made me laugh out loud. In a good way.

You really should try that next time your pulled over... For the children

The way I see it is... if you have a CPL, doesn't that mean you're a good guy? Any cop, with two (working) brain cells shouldn't care. It's the libtarded cops that are the scary ones.

Well in all honesty I don't know where he was parked, all I do know is that when he got me I was a mere 1 mile from the exit I take to get to your hood. The trooper said he clocked me a few miles back and also took him awhile to catch me.......................Fucking GTI!!!!!!!!

Unless I am required to disclose I am carrying or am asked to exit the vehicle, I NEVER disclose. Why? My reason is why turn a traffic stop into a "man with a gun stop."

http://www.washingtongunrights.com

Usually I will already have my wallet out and in my lap, along with the registration. So there is never a need for me to reach for things.

I do not disclose*, unless directly asked. However I will NOT consent to a disarmament. There is no reason for anyone's gun to be leaving any holsters.

* = Depending on where I am, I sometimes will hand over my CPL and DL because I know the department and a CPL can get you out of tickets. However I still do not consent to searches or seizure.

This is what I've been wondering about lately. Only once has the officer asked to handle the firearm and at the time it was inoperable and unloaded so I didn't care. That said when carrying normally I would refuse to let the officer handle my loaded firearm. It's safe right where it is and it's staying there until they arrest me. But could I be charged with failure to obey(again, lol) if I refused to comply with a request to let the officer disarm me?

There is no risk to not telling. If he asks, you reply. There's no obligation to say anything up front.

I've not seen any screens where the plate search was wired to show if a CPL was held by the owner. From what I have seen it always requires a 2nd step. (not I haven't looked at WSP)

It is generally better form to say "would you like to see my CPL?" rather than "I HAVE A GUN!!!!!!!!!!". It keeps the officer in control of what is going on and a lot less nervous. Of course, this is only if you WANT him to know you have a gun. (because then he'll say, "oh are you carrying?")

I hope for your sake if they decide to detain you that you don't resist if they want to disarm you.

If it is a question "can I take/look at your gun?" then you can say no. Police will ask for things a lot of times that they have no right to do, hoping that an uninformed person will agree. It isn't against the law to ASK, they're just relying on your stupidity. Like "can I search your vehicle for drugs?".

But if they detain you for an investigation and decide to take the gun, then resisting that is obstructing. The time to argue the 4th amendment is in court or in a complaint, not on the street.

Most cops also know it is safer to not handle guns. If you are just sitting in your car with a holstered gun and not doing anything aggressive or furtive, it is a lot simpler and safer for everyone to just leave you be.

There's a difference between a traffic stop (failed to signal) and the cop thinking something might be going on (fleeing from burglary, carrying drugs, felon with a firearm, whatever). You don't need to escalate the situation by being a jackass. If a cop asks me something that isn't a clear command (like GET ON THE GROUND) I'm always going to clarify and say "is that a request or a direction?"

Of course my interactions with the police as a customer (even for traffic stops) have become fewer and fewer. And it depends also on what kind of cop has stopped you. All the cops I know are looking for a reason to NOT give you a ticket, and to NOT escalate things, they hate paperwork.

Well there's a good question. Failure to obey "obstructing an investigation" would only be legit if they are making a legal request and you fail to comply. From what I can discern, asking to you to surrender your legally concealed weapon isn't a legal request. They could probably get a sandy vag over it and trump up some other charges or turn a small speeding ticked into a bigger one, but that's rolling the dice on the candor of the officer.

I feel like if they say "for may safety during this stop I'd like you to remove your weapon" then you respond to them "for my safety during this stop I'd like you to remove your weapon" and see how they respond.

If they say "can I take a look at your pistol?" You say, "can I take a look at yours?"

This here is the issue, a vast majority of interactions with LE for myself and I assume others are situations where I'm being detained for investigation. A traffic stop in and of itself is detainment for investigation. This form of detainment is not arrest, the officer is empowered to only do so much. Does that empowerment include such actions as placing me in cuffs and disarming me? I'd call that an arrest, I'm sure they'd call it detainment for various reasons.

Also of course refusal is not resisting, resisting arrest is a crime, but I'm not under arrest(yet), I'm being detained for investigation. I'd simply be refusing to comply with an order I consider unlawful, unreasonable, and unsafe. I find no specific law on the subject and from what I've seen the court has gone both ways, but I know of no specific example regarding forced(not voluntary) disarmament of a legally possessed weapon. That said "failure to obey" is a very broad law that they can slap on just about anyone. I was charged with it for calling an officer a bitch, that was kind of fun.

Exactly, the exact legal issues are one thing, the actual interaction with the officer is the other. The letter of the law and the enforcement of the law often have surprisingly little in common.

I find being appropriately compliant and keeping a non-combative tone will go a long way with most officers even while technically you are disagreeing with them. That said even while sweet talking an officer we need to know and understand the letter of the law to understand and decide how and where to push the limits.

YES you can be detained (and not arrested) in cuffs. Plenty of people disagree with this process, we get to see them on the new sites/videos getting tased, tackled, shot. Generally speaking people in cuffs don't get to keep their firearms on them.



Actually it can be. If you're given a lawful directive and you "refuse", that's obstruction. Now, they then have to prove that later in court but on the side of the road... not a great place to disagree over it. That's why I would ask "is that a request, or a directive/command?"

RCW 9A.76.020

"(1) A person is guilty of obstructing a law enforcement officer if the person willfully hinders, delays, or obstructs any law enforcement officer in the discharge of his or her official powers or duties."

So some examples:

"Can I look in your trunk?" (that's a request, you can refuse it. If they have a legal reason for a search, they won't be asking you, they'll be TELLING you)

"Go stand over next to the curb while I pat down your friend" (that's a directive, if you say no, or refuse to cooperate, that's obstruction)



It the directive is unsafe like "go stand in the middle of I-90", it won't even get to court because the prosecutors will say "are you serious?" to the cop and it won't go anywhere.

I've seen several "obstruction" arguments happen on the street between cops and media, it was definitely not pretty but the cops also know the bar is actually pretty high on that for people who aren't otherwise committing some crime. (e.g. you're standing watching a car accident scene but you're in the way of where they want to measure something, and a cop asks you to move back. He's going to give you a LOT of chances before he arrests you.)