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July 01, 2019.... Is it the end of the world?
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Massivedesign
Site Admin
Location: Olympia, WA Joined: Fri Mar 11, 2011 Posts: 38308
Real Name: Dan
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Guns4Liberty wrote: Someone on a gun-related Facebook page just pointed.. Yup, this was brought up earlier in this thread. viewtopic.php?f=47&t=101351&start=30#p1006527
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:31 am |
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shaggy
Site Supporter
Location: Snohomish Co Joined: Thu Sep 13, 2018 Posts: 1811
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Guns4Liberty wrote: Someone on a gun-related Facebook page just pointed something out that I think is interesting (not saying it's correct, just thought-provoking). He was talking about how transfers of frames/receivers (like AR lowers) will not be able to be processed come July 1 (when FBI discontinues the courtesy instant NICS checks for everything but long guns). The reason is because frames/receivers fall into the "other" category, and the state will have to do the BGCs themselves. But the new state transfer forms (see below) do not have a way to mark the firearm as an "other"; it only provides options for either semi-automatic rifle or pistol. So, with lowers being neither of those, but unable to be processed by NICS after July 1, there will be no way to complete the state transfer application. Thoughts?
The feds need to to more transfers than just long guns, shotguns should be included, does anyone know if they have to do "others" and that is why it is ommited?
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 11:54 am |
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quantsuff
Site Supporter
Location: central wa Joined: Mon Mar 21, 2011 Posts: 3554
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shaggy wrote: Guns4Liberty wrote: Someone on a gun-related Facebook page just pointed something out that I think is interesting (not saying it's correct, just thought-provoking). He was talking about how transfers of frames/receivers (like AR lowers) will not be able to be processed come July 1 (when FBI discontinues the courtesy instant NICS checks for everything but long guns). The reason is because frames/receivers fall into the "other" category, and the state will have to do the BGCs themselves. But the new state transfer forms (see below) do not have a way to mark the firearm as an "other"; it only provides options for either semi-automatic rifle or pistol. So, with lowers being neither of those, but unable to be processed by NICS after July 1, there will be no way to complete the state transfer application. Thoughts?
The feds need to to more transfers than just long guns, shotguns should be included, does anyone know if they have to do "others" and that is why it is ommited? Why isn't the inference that "others/shotguns (including semi-auto SGs?) do not require bgc - they are not on the form, therefore the form does not apply to them?
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:00 pm |
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AR15L
Site Supporter
Location: Nampa, Idaho Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 Posts: 19463
Real Name: Rick
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quantsuff wrote: Why isn't the inference that "others/shotguns (including semi-auto SGs?) do not require bgc - they are not on the form, therefore the form does not apply to them? BINGO!!! There is our loophole. Buy an AR shotgun and put on a regular .223/5.56 upper. You're welcome.
_________________ ‘What’s the point of being a citizen if an illegal gets all the benefits’
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:20 pm |
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AR15L
Site Supporter
Location: Nampa, Idaho Joined: Thu Mar 17, 2011 Posts: 19463
Real Name: Rick
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For reference: Quote: Most AR-pattern shotguns only superficially resemble the modern sporting rifle and use a typical shotgun gas system to operate, but the Omni Hybrid AR-15 .410 shotgun, introduced by American Tactical Inc. (ATI) in 2017, is a true .410 AR upper and magazine combo that can be fitted to any standard AR-15 lower. The gun is laid out just like a typical AR, but there are some key differences, according to this story from firearmsnews.com]( http://www.firearmsnews.com/editorial/r ... 10/316579#), which says there are some screws in the lower receiver where ARs normally have pins, and the upper has a roll pin where there typically is none. The Omni Hybrid runs on a gas operated, short stroke balanced piston system.
_________________ ‘What’s the point of being a citizen if an illegal gets all the benefits’
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:24 pm |
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usrifle
Site Supporter
Location: RENTON Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 Posts: 20771
Real Name: John
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Where did it say you could put a 5.56 upper on that Lower? I didn't see that from the article you posted.
_________________ Mr. Q wrote: so basically, if you have to smoke some asshole, make sure they become fertilizer and then Bounce? got it.
Guntrader wrote: Huh, maybe I was an asshole.
NRA Member/RSO SAF 5 Year Donor GOA Member
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:38 pm |
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Guns4Liberty
Site Supporter
Location: Lynnwood/Bothell Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 Posts: 8562
Real Name: Curtis
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Oops! Somehow I missed that nugget the first go-around.
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 12:45 pm |
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MadPick
Site Admin
Location: Renton, WA Joined: Sun Mar 13, 2011 Posts: 52039
Real Name: Steve
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This is probably a good time to recall that a lower is not a "firearm" per WA state's definition, and if you're doing a private sale, an FFL transfer is not required.
_________________SteveBenefactor Life Member, National Rifle AssociationLife Member, Second Amendment FoundationPatriot & Life Member, Gun Owners of AmericaLife Member, Citizens Committee for the Right to Keep and Bear ArmsLegal Action Supporter, Firearms Policy CoalitionMember, NAGR/NFGRPlease support the organizations that support all of us.Leave it cleaner than you found it.
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 7:31 pm |
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Guns4Liberty
Site Supporter
Location: Lynnwood/Bothell Joined: Thu Jul 31, 2014 Posts: 8562
Real Name: Curtis
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MadPick wrote: This is probably a good time to recall that a lower is not a "firearm" per WA state's definition, and if you're doing a private sale, an FFL transfer is not required. Preach it, Steve! I explain this to people all the time, but no one seems to want to listen. It's sad when we voluntarily give up rights unnecessarily because we feel like we have to "play it safe".
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Tue Jun 11, 2019 9:05 pm |
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AK_Goes_Bang_Bang
Location: Centralia Joined: Tue Jun 4, 2019 Posts: 33
Real Name: Derek
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MadPick wrote: This is probably a good time to recall that a lower is not a "firearm" per WA state's definition, and if you're doing a private sale, an FFL transfer is not required. What if I wanted to buy a pistol frame/lower does that still count as not a firearm?
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Sun Jun 16, 2019 1:27 pm |
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DGM33
Site Moderator
Location: Renton/Kent Joined: Wed Feb 15, 2012 Posts: 3550
Real Name: Jacy
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When I-594 went into effect, gun owners grumbled and complained but complied for the most part because it was merely an inconvenience. Some owners have continued to buy/sell/trade privately without complying because they saw it as a BS law with no real teeth that would almost never be prosecuted. With the implementation of I-1639, I personally foresee all of that going out the window and a LOT more gun owners saying “f*ck it” and going back to the old way of private transfers. Not that I *condone* it, because I never would on a public forum. Especially as a mod. But I’m happy to get together and just talk about guns offline any time.
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Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:06 pm |
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usrifle
Site Supporter
Location: RENTON Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 Posts: 20771
Real Name: John
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DGM33 wrote: When I-594 went into effect, gun owners grumbled and complained but complied for the most part because it was merely an inconvenience. Some owners have continued to buy/sell/trade privately without complying because they saw it as a BS law with no real teeth that would almost never be prosecuted. With the implementation of I-1639, I personally foresee all of that going out the window and a LOT more gun owners saying “f*ck it” and going back to the old way of private transfers. Not that I *condone* it, because I never would on a public forum. Especially as a mod. But I’m happy to get together and just talk about guns offline any time. I am in total agreement Jacy. I would never condone breaking any Stupid feel good that does nothing Law, but we can certainly discuss our feelings about that in a more private setting.
_________________ Mr. Q wrote: so basically, if you have to smoke some asshole, make sure they become fertilizer and then Bounce? got it.
Guntrader wrote: Huh, maybe I was an asshole.
NRA Member/RSO SAF 5 Year Donor GOA Member
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Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:29 pm |
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zombie66
Site Supporter
Location: Spanaway WA Joined: Wed Jul 6, 2011 Posts: 6312
Real Name: Hugo Stiglitz
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DGM33 wrote: When I-594 went into effect, gun owners grumbled and complained but complied for the most part because it was merely an inconvenience. Some owners have continued to buy/sell/trade privately without complying because they saw it as a BS law with no real teeth that would almost never be prosecuted. With the implementation of I-1639, I personally foresee all of that going out the window and a LOT more gun owners saying “f*ck it” and going back to the old way of private transfers. Not that I *condone* it, because I never would on a public forum. Especially as a mod. But I’m happy to get together and just talk about guns offline any time. +1 Billion
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Sun Jun 16, 2019 4:40 pm |
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Pvanderzee
Site Supporter
Location: Bow Joined: Tue Apr 2, 2013 Posts: 2688
Real Name: Phill
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AK_Goes_Bang_Bang wrote: MadPick wrote: This is probably a good time to recall that a lower is not a "firearm" per WA state's definition, and if you're doing a private sale, an FFL transfer is not required. What if I wanted to buy a pistol frame/lower does that still count as not a firearm? There is no such thing as a "pistol lower," legally speaking. A lower is an "other" according to the feds, and a nothing according to the state. Doesn't matter what furniture it has. If there is no barrel, it does not meet any federal definition except "other" because all the specific definitions (pistol, rifle, and shotgun) have barrel specifics in the definition. Ex: The term “Rifle” means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed metallic cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger. The part in bold is what I'm referring to. If there is no bore at all, it cannot be a rifle. You will find similar mentions of a "bore" and "chamber" in the GCA definition of a pistol.
_________________Sinus211 wrote: Z66 and I still fuck on the regular. zombie66 wrote: Mikey is a Bossy Bottom.....
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Sun Jun 16, 2019 5:01 pm |
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AK_Goes_Bang_Bang
Location: Centralia Joined: Tue Jun 4, 2019 Posts: 33
Real Name: Derek
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Pvanderzee wrote: AK_Goes_Bang_Bang wrote: MadPick wrote: This is probably a good time to recall that a lower is not a "firearm" per WA state's definition, and if you're doing a private sale, an FFL transfer is not required. What if I wanted to buy a pistol frame/lower does that still count as not a firearm? There is no such thing as a "pistol lower," legally speaking. A lower is an "other" according to the feds, and a nothing according to the state. Doesn't matter what furniture it has. If there is no barrel, it does not meet any federal definition except "other" because all the specific definitions (pistol, rifle, and shotgun) have barrel specifics in the definition. Ex: The term “Rifle” means a weapon designed or redesigned, made or remade, and intended to be fired from the shoulder and designed or redesigned and made or remade to use the energy of the explosive in a fixed metallic cartridge to fire only a single projectile through a rifled bore for each single pull of the trigger. The part in bold is what I'm referring to. If there is no bore at all, it cannot be a rifle. You will find similar mentions of a "bore" and "chamber" in the GCA definition of a pistol. Interesting... Thank you for further clarifying!
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Mon Jun 17, 2019 5:48 pm |
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