Gun store Shooting Locations It is currently Mon Aug 19, 2019 7:04 am


Rules Brads Guns Rainier Arms McCallen Killer Innovations Fessleman Firearms
WGO Chat Room Rehv Arms Vantage Reloading
Gear Fortis WCA 2A Ind. Pintos WAC
Calendar


Forum rules


Nothing contained in this section shall be construed as legal advice. All members and guests are advised to perform due diligence in regards to laws and legal actions.



Reply to topic  [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
 How to join the 2 guns club 
Author Message
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Camano Island, WA
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016
Posts: 3223
Real Name: Jason
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)

_________________
Spoiler: show
"Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm -- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves." – T.S. Eliot

"The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker

A careful definition of words would destroy half the agenda of the political left and scrutinizing evidence would destroy the other half. - Thomas Sowell

"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the innocent and law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless, and that the law will permit them to have only such rights and liberties as the lawless will allow...

For society does not control crime, ever, by forcing the law-abiding to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of criminals. Society controls crime by forcing the criminals to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of the law-abiding." - Jeff Snyder

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the minds of most men, and in its best examples it constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

Jeff Cooper
1997 The Art of the Rifle Page 1.

Spoiler: show
SUGGEST CASE BE SUBMITTED ON APPELLANT'S BRIEF. UNABLE TO OBTAIN ANY MONEY FROM CLIENTS TO BE PRESENT & ARGUE BRIEF.

The defense attorney's telegram to the clerk of the Supreme Court, March 29, 1939, in re United States. v. Miller.

You don't need to go to Law School to understand the constitutional implications of that.

“You can’t cut the throat of every cocksucker whose character it would improve.”
Spoiler: show
MadPick wrote:
Bob Ferguson is a total piece of shit. Of this, I am convinced.

cityslicker wrote:
I don't want to be told that I can't remove the tree by some tree-hugging pole smoker from the eat-a-dick foundation/Olympia/King County.

WARNING: I DEBATE IGNORAMUSES FOR MY OWN ENTERTAINMENT


Wed Apr 04, 2018 5:28 am
Profile
User avatar

Location: Tacoma
Joined: Tue Nov 27, 2012
Posts: 1261
It's two pistols in one day, shouldn't apply to two long guns.


Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:20 am
Profile
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer
User avatar
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer

Location: Tacoma, Washington
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014
Posts: 5706
jdhbulseye wrote:
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)


Keep it under five for the long guns and don’t sweat paper work.

_________________
BLACK HAMMER ARMS
1911 Pistolsmithing
Firearm Refinishing
NEMO Arms Authorized Dealer
http://www.blackhammerarms.com
http://www.facebook.com/blackhammerarms


Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:22 am
Profile WWW
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Bonney Lake, WA
Joined: Mon Dec 3, 2012
Posts: 367
Real Name: Kevin
sreyemj wrote:
It's two pistols in one day, shouldn't apply to two long guns.


Or two pistols within five business days as well.


Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:29 am
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Camano Island, WA
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016
Posts: 3223
Real Name: Jason
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)


Keep it under five for the long guns and don’t sweat paper work.



Why under 5?

Also does anyone know if there is a certain frequency of purchases that if exceeded gets you flagged or potentially visited? I'd rather not interact directly with the BATFE FLEAs

_________________
Spoiler: show
"Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm -- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves." – T.S. Eliot

"The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker

A careful definition of words would destroy half the agenda of the political left and scrutinizing evidence would destroy the other half. - Thomas Sowell

"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the innocent and law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless, and that the law will permit them to have only such rights and liberties as the lawless will allow...

For society does not control crime, ever, by forcing the law-abiding to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of criminals. Society controls crime by forcing the criminals to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of the law-abiding." - Jeff Snyder

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the minds of most men, and in its best examples it constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

Jeff Cooper
1997 The Art of the Rifle Page 1.

Spoiler: show
SUGGEST CASE BE SUBMITTED ON APPELLANT'S BRIEF. UNABLE TO OBTAIN ANY MONEY FROM CLIENTS TO BE PRESENT & ARGUE BRIEF.

The defense attorney's telegram to the clerk of the Supreme Court, March 29, 1939, in re United States. v. Miller.

You don't need to go to Law School to understand the constitutional implications of that.

“You can’t cut the throat of every cocksucker whose character it would improve.”
Spoiler: show
MadPick wrote:
Bob Ferguson is a total piece of shit. Of this, I am convinced.

cityslicker wrote:
I don't want to be told that I can't remove the tree by some tree-hugging pole smoker from the eat-a-dick foundation/Olympia/King County.

WARNING: I DEBATE IGNORAMUSES FOR MY OWN ENTERTAINMENT


Wed Apr 04, 2018 8:38 am
Profile
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer
User avatar
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer

Location: Tacoma, Washington
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014
Posts: 5706
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)


Keep it under five for the long guns and don’t sweat paper work.



Why under 5?

Also does anyone know if there is a certain frequency of purchases that if exceeded gets you flagged or potentially visited? I'd rather not interact directly with the BATFE FLEAs


I’m going to free style my response.

On the 4473 there’s four rows for recording firearms being transferred on page 3.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/4473- ... 9/download


Then add in this form as well

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/form/ ... orm-331012

_________________
BLACK HAMMER ARMS
1911 Pistolsmithing
Firearm Refinishing
NEMO Arms Authorized Dealer
http://www.blackhammerarms.com
http://www.facebook.com/blackhammerarms


Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:25 am
Profile WWW
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Lawton, OK
Joined: Sat Mar 19, 2011
Posts: 14521
Real Name: Chuck
You all need to stop stressing, and buy what the eff you want, and when you want to.

_________________
"The beauty of the Second Amendment is that it will not be needed until they try to take it." Thomas Jefferson
"Evil often triumphs, but never conquers." Joseph Roux


Wed Apr 04, 2018 10:56 am
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Camano Island, WA
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016
Posts: 3223
Real Name: Jason
golddigger14s wrote:
You all need to stop stressing, and buy what the eff you want, and when you want to.



You mistake my question for apprehension. I'm not stressing just looking for info. I like to know as much as I can about something before I decide to do it.

_________________
Spoiler: show
"Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm -- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves." – T.S. Eliot

"The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker

A careful definition of words would destroy half the agenda of the political left and scrutinizing evidence would destroy the other half. - Thomas Sowell

"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the innocent and law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless, and that the law will permit them to have only such rights and liberties as the lawless will allow...

For society does not control crime, ever, by forcing the law-abiding to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of criminals. Society controls crime by forcing the criminals to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of the law-abiding." - Jeff Snyder

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the minds of most men, and in its best examples it constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

Jeff Cooper
1997 The Art of the Rifle Page 1.

Spoiler: show
SUGGEST CASE BE SUBMITTED ON APPELLANT'S BRIEF. UNABLE TO OBTAIN ANY MONEY FROM CLIENTS TO BE PRESENT & ARGUE BRIEF.

The defense attorney's telegram to the clerk of the Supreme Court, March 29, 1939, in re United States. v. Miller.

You don't need to go to Law School to understand the constitutional implications of that.

“You can’t cut the throat of every cocksucker whose character it would improve.”
Spoiler: show
MadPick wrote:
Bob Ferguson is a total piece of shit. Of this, I am convinced.

cityslicker wrote:
I don't want to be told that I can't remove the tree by some tree-hugging pole smoker from the eat-a-dick foundation/Olympia/King County.

WARNING: I DEBATE IGNORAMUSES FOR MY OWN ENTERTAINMENT


Wed Apr 04, 2018 11:21 am
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Camano Island, WA
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016
Posts: 3223
Real Name: Jason
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)


Keep it under five for the long guns and don’t sweat paper work.



Why under 5?

Also does anyone know if there is a certain frequency of purchases that if exceeded gets you flagged or potentially visited? I'd rather not interact directly with the BATFE FLEAs


I’m going to free style my response.

On the 4473 there’s four rows for recording firearms being transferred on page 3.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/4473- ... 9/download


Then add in this form as well

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/form/ ... orm-331012


Well, thank you. It seems the instructions on the form you provided the link for seem to contradict some of the information I have been given in the past, namely:

Quote:
1. This form is to be used by licensees to report all transactions in which an unlicensed person acquired, at one time or during five consecutive business days, two or more semi-automatic rifles larger than .22 caliber (including .223/5.56 caliber) with the ability to accept a detachable magazine. This form is not required when the rifles are returned to the same person from whom they are received


So it absolutely CAN apply to two long guns, if they meet certain criteria.

In addition...

I found this description of why the form is needed to be hilarious:

Quote:
The information is used to determine if the buyer (transferee) is involved in a unlawful activity, or is a person prohibited by law from obtaining firearms.


Especially when I can find nothing on the form that isn't already on the 4473 that I can tell which would allow them to "determine if the buyer (transferee) is involved in a unlawful activity, or is a person prohibited by law from obtaining firearms." So i think this form is bullshit. Welcome to the department of redundancy department.

_________________
Spoiler: show
"Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm -- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves." – T.S. Eliot

"The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker

A careful definition of words would destroy half the agenda of the political left and scrutinizing evidence would destroy the other half. - Thomas Sowell

"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the innocent and law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless, and that the law will permit them to have only such rights and liberties as the lawless will allow...

For society does not control crime, ever, by forcing the law-abiding to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of criminals. Society controls crime by forcing the criminals to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of the law-abiding." - Jeff Snyder

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the minds of most men, and in its best examples it constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

Jeff Cooper
1997 The Art of the Rifle Page 1.

Spoiler: show
SUGGEST CASE BE SUBMITTED ON APPELLANT'S BRIEF. UNABLE TO OBTAIN ANY MONEY FROM CLIENTS TO BE PRESENT & ARGUE BRIEF.

The defense attorney's telegram to the clerk of the Supreme Court, March 29, 1939, in re United States. v. Miller.

You don't need to go to Law School to understand the constitutional implications of that.

“You can’t cut the throat of every cocksucker whose character it would improve.”
Spoiler: show
MadPick wrote:
Bob Ferguson is a total piece of shit. Of this, I am convinced.

cityslicker wrote:
I don't want to be told that I can't remove the tree by some tree-hugging pole smoker from the eat-a-dick foundation/Olympia/King County.

WARNING: I DEBATE IGNORAMUSES FOR MY OWN ENTERTAINMENT


Wed Apr 04, 2018 11:28 am
Profile
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer
User avatar
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer

Location: Tacoma, Washington
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014
Posts: 5706
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)


Keep it under five for the long guns and don’t sweat paper work.



Why under 5?

Also does anyone know if there is a certain frequency of purchases that if exceeded gets you flagged or potentially visited? I'd rather not interact directly with the BATFE FLEAs


I’m going to free style my response.

On the 4473 there’s four rows for recording firearms being transferred on page 3.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/4473- ... 9/download


Then add in this form as well

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/form/ ... orm-331012


Well, thank you. It seems the instructions on the form you provided the link for seem to contradict some of the information I have been given in the past, namely:

Quote:
1. This form is to be used by licensees to report all transactions in which an unlicensed person acquired, at one time or during five consecutive business days, two or more semi-automatic rifles larger than .22 caliber (including .223/5.56 caliber) with the ability to accept a detachable magazine. This form is not required when the rifles are returned to the same person from whom they are received


So it absolutely CAN apply to two long guns, if they meet certain criteria.

In addition...

I found this description of why the form is needed to be hilarious:

Quote:
The information is used to determine if the buyer (transferee) is involved in a unlawful activity, or is a person prohibited by law from obtaining firearms.


Especially when I can find nothing on the form that isn't already on the 4473 that I can tell which would allow them to "determine if the buyer (transferee) is involved in a unlawful activity, or is a person prohibited by law from obtaining firearms." So i think this form is bullshit. Welcome to the department of redundancy department.


You’re welcome.

In my opinion, the 4473 isn’t really redundant. The multiple sales document is used as an “alert the feds to investigate the purchaser”. If you’re not already on “the list”, a 4473 background check isn’t going to make you pop up on it.

_________________
BLACK HAMMER ARMS
1911 Pistolsmithing
Firearm Refinishing
NEMO Arms Authorized Dealer
http://www.blackhammerarms.com
http://www.facebook.com/blackhammerarms


Wed Apr 04, 2018 2:26 pm
Profile WWW
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Camano Island, WA
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016
Posts: 3223
Real Name: Jason
dreadi wrote:
You’re welcome.

In my opinion, the 4473 isn’t really redundant. The multiple sales document is used as an “alert the feds to investigate the purchaser”. If you’re not already on “the list”, a 4473 background check isn’t going to make you pop up on it.


I'm pretty sure I am already on a list somewhere. Probably multiple lists.

Makes me want to go buy 8 guns at once.

_________________
Spoiler: show
"Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm -- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves." – T.S. Eliot

"The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker

A careful definition of words would destroy half the agenda of the political left and scrutinizing evidence would destroy the other half. - Thomas Sowell

"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the innocent and law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless, and that the law will permit them to have only such rights and liberties as the lawless will allow...

For society does not control crime, ever, by forcing the law-abiding to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of criminals. Society controls crime by forcing the criminals to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of the law-abiding." - Jeff Snyder

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the minds of most men, and in its best examples it constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

Jeff Cooper
1997 The Art of the Rifle Page 1.

Spoiler: show
SUGGEST CASE BE SUBMITTED ON APPELLANT'S BRIEF. UNABLE TO OBTAIN ANY MONEY FROM CLIENTS TO BE PRESENT & ARGUE BRIEF.

The defense attorney's telegram to the clerk of the Supreme Court, March 29, 1939, in re United States. v. Miller.

You don't need to go to Law School to understand the constitutional implications of that.

“You can’t cut the throat of every cocksucker whose character it would improve.”
Spoiler: show
MadPick wrote:
Bob Ferguson is a total piece of shit. Of this, I am convinced.

cityslicker wrote:
I don't want to be told that I can't remove the tree by some tree-hugging pole smoker from the eat-a-dick foundation/Olympia/King County.

WARNING: I DEBATE IGNORAMUSES FOR MY OWN ENTERTAINMENT


Wed Apr 04, 2018 2:28 pm
Profile
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer
User avatar
Site Supporter / FFL Dealer

Location: Tacoma, Washington
Joined: Fri Nov 21, 2014
Posts: 5706
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
You’re welcome.

In my opinion, the 4473 isn’t really redundant. The multiple sales document is used as an “alert the feds to investigate the purchaser”. If you’re not already on “the list”, a 4473 background check isn’t going to make you pop up on it.


I'm pretty sure I am already on a list somewhere. Probably multiple lists.

Makes me want to go buy 8 guns at once.


Need a package deal?

_________________
BLACK HAMMER ARMS
1911 Pistolsmithing
Firearm Refinishing
NEMO Arms Authorized Dealer
http://www.blackhammerarms.com
http://www.facebook.com/blackhammerarms


Wed Apr 04, 2018 3:17 pm
Profile WWW
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Camano Island, WA
Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2016
Posts: 3223
Real Name: Jason
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
You’re welcome.

In my opinion, the 4473 isn’t really redundant. The multiple sales document is used as an “alert the feds to investigate the purchaser”. If you’re not already on “the list”, a 4473 background check isn’t going to make you pop up on it.


I'm pretty sure I am already on a list somewhere. Probably multiple lists.

Makes me want to go buy 8 guns at once.


Need a package deal?



For now its almost certainly only going to be 2.

And I think you are located a bit far south for me. That said I like to keep my options open....PM for quote inbound.

_________________
Spoiler: show
"Half the harm that is done in this world is due to people who want to feel important. They don't mean to do harm -- but the harm does not interest them. Or they do not see it, or they justify it because they are absorbed in the endless struggle to think well of themselves." – T.S. Eliot

"The right of self defence is the first law of nature: in most governments it has been the study of rulers to confine this right within the narrowest limits possible. Wherever standing armies are kept up, and the right of the people to keep and bear arms is, under any colour or pretext whatsoever, prohibited, liberty, if not already annihilated, is on the brink of destruction." - St. George Tucker

A careful definition of words would destroy half the agenda of the political left and scrutinizing evidence would destroy the other half. - Thomas Sowell

"To ban guns because criminals use them is to tell the innocent and law-abiding that their rights and liberties depend not on their own conduct, but on the conduct of the guilty and the lawless, and that the law will permit them to have only such rights and liberties as the lawless will allow...

For society does not control crime, ever, by forcing the law-abiding to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of criminals. Society controls crime by forcing the criminals to accommodate themselves to the expected behavior of the law-abiding." - Jeff Snyder

Personal weapons are what raised mankind out of the mud, and the rifle is the queen of personal weapons. The possession of a good rifle, as well as the skill to use it well, truly makes a man the monarch of all he surveys. It realizes the ancient dream of the Jovian thunderbolt, and as such it is the embodiment of personal power. For this reason it exercises a curious influence over the minds of most men, and in its best examples it constitutes an object of affection unmatched by any other inanimate object.

Jeff Cooper
1997 The Art of the Rifle Page 1.

Spoiler: show
SUGGEST CASE BE SUBMITTED ON APPELLANT'S BRIEF. UNABLE TO OBTAIN ANY MONEY FROM CLIENTS TO BE PRESENT & ARGUE BRIEF.

The defense attorney's telegram to the clerk of the Supreme Court, March 29, 1939, in re United States. v. Miller.

You don't need to go to Law School to understand the constitutional implications of that.

“You can’t cut the throat of every cocksucker whose character it would improve.”
Spoiler: show
MadPick wrote:
Bob Ferguson is a total piece of shit. Of this, I am convinced.

cityslicker wrote:
I don't want to be told that I can't remove the tree by some tree-hugging pole smoker from the eat-a-dick foundation/Olympia/King County.

WARNING: I DEBATE IGNORAMUSES FOR MY OWN ENTERTAINMENT


Wed Apr 04, 2018 3:22 pm
Profile
Site Supporter
User avatar
Site Supporter

Location: Piece/Clallam
Joined: Wed Oct 17, 2012
Posts: 10688
you can buy 100 long guns in Washington state there is no reporting for long guns

all they have to do is write the same info on a sheet of paper and staple it to the 4473.

excel spread sheets are the best way

_________________
Image

Yaki's - last journey

Promote a Growth Mindset. Don't let a fixed mindset not allow change for the better.

pow·er trip - noun - a self-aggrandizing quest for ever-increasing control over others.


Wed Apr 25, 2018 7:21 pm
Profile
User avatar

Location: Seatac
Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2011
Posts: 2318
Real Name: Chester
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
dreadi wrote:
jdhbulseye wrote:
I may soon be renewing my membership to the "2 gun club", i.e. purchasing 2 guns in the same transaction, which I have done at least once before. I know its been discussed elsewhere from time to time but in light of the aforementioned I am curious about all of the circumstances that can invoke the need for the bullshit 2 gun paperwork to be filled out by a dealer.

Last time I did the 2 gat challenge I bought 2 pistols from Cabela's. Which I understand means the dealer is required to fill out a special form (cant recall the name of the form) and send it in. Where do they have to send it again? I have forgotten.

This time, if I do it, the 2 boomsticks will be long guns. Does this still trigger the requirement for more paper?

I have a CPL (Not that that makes one lick of difference)


Keep it under five for the long guns and don’t sweat paper work.



Why under 5?

Also does anyone know if there is a certain frequency of purchases that if exceeded gets you flagged or potentially visited? I'd rather not interact directly with the BATFE FLEAs


I’m going to free style my response.

On the 4473 there’s four rows for recording firearms being transferred on page 3.

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/4473- ... 9/download


Then add in this form as well

https://www.atf.gov/firearms/docs/form/ ... orm-331012


Well, thank you. It seems the instructions on the form you provided the link for seem to contradict some of the information I have been given in the past, namely:

Quote:
1. This form is to be used by licensees to report all transactions in which an unlicensed person acquired, at one time or during five consecutive business days, two or more semi-automatic rifles larger than .22 caliber (including .223/5.56 caliber) with the ability to accept a detachable magazine. This form is not required when the rifles are returned to the same person from whom they are received


So it absolutely CAN apply to two long guns, if they meet certain criteria.

In addition...

I found this description of why the form is needed to be hilarious:

Quote:
The information is used to determine if the buyer (transferee) is involved in a unlawful activity, or is a person prohibited by law from obtaining firearms.


Especially when I can find nothing on the form that isn't already on the 4473 that I can tell which would allow them to "determine if the buyer (transferee) is involved in a unlawful activity, or is a person prohibited by law from obtaining firearms." So i think this form is bullshit. Welcome to the department of redundancy department.



You can buy as many firearms as you want (other than handguns or if you are in certain states) without the ATF knowing what you bought. You can buy 40 shotguns or receivers at once if you want. The dealer just has to attach another sheet with the same information as on the 4473. Handwritten on ruled paper, typed, printed by your boundbook software, whatever.

The form for multiple rifles only applies on the SW Border... https://www.atf.gov/resource-center/doc ... f/download

It's not redundant because just like the multiple handgun form, the ATF doesn't get the number or type of firearms. Make, model, serial number, are not reported. Just stored on the 4473. They are looking for people making lots of purchases and keep an eye on those to see if they show up in trace requests from local PDs.


Mon Jun 25, 2018 8:23 pm
Profile
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Reply to topic   [ 19 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 9 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum



Rent Me Pintos NRA SAF CCKRBA
Aldersons e-arms.com


Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group
Designed by ST Software for PTF.
[ Time : 0.635s | 14 Queries | GZIP : On ]