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It is currently Thu Apr 18, 2024 6:36 pm
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Did I screw up? (brass to hot)
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harleyjasondavidson
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Location: 1.5 hour N of seattle, sedro woolley Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 Posts: 1708
Real Name: J.
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I have a little toaster oven that melted a whole tray of powder coated bullets, and it was set at 400F. Pure lead melts at 621, my lead was wheel weights which melts much higher, and keep in mind the toaster oven was set at 400 NOT even turned up all the way.
Don't trust your toaster oven temperature.
There's obviously an OP here that's not experienced in this stuff and advice is being given to use that $5 worth of brass at risk of injury or firearm damage.
That's fucked up.
Throw away the $5 worth of brass and move on.
_________________ If it doesn't run on 2 wheels or a trigger... save your breath i'm, not listening.
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Sun Jun 13, 2021 4:34 pm |
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Yondering
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Location: Skagit County, in the woods Joined: Tue Apr 7, 2015 Posts: 1058
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harleyjasondavidson wrote: I have a little toaster oven that melted a whole tray of powder coated bullets, and it was set at 400F. Pure lead melts at 621, my lead was wheel weights which melts much higher, and keep in mind the toaster oven was set at 400 NOT even turned up all the way.
You don't seem to understand lead melting temperatures any better than brass annealing temps. WW lead melts at lower temp than pure; it varies a lot by alloy but in the neighborhood of 450-460 *F for typical WW alloys. http://www.lasc.us/CastBulletNotes.htmLike I said, understanding a bit more about what's happening goes a long way with this sort of thing, and you're not doing anyone favors by giving advice otherwise.
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Mon Jun 14, 2021 5:20 pm |
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harleyjasondavidson
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Location: 1.5 hour N of seattle, sedro woolley Joined: Wed Oct 26, 2011 Posts: 1708
Real Name: J.
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Not when alloyed with zinc it doesn't melt lower. And in NO case does it melt at 400 degrees!
This isn't a dick measuring contest dude. YOU are giving potentially dangerous advice with VERY little information from the OP, where I'm saying he should play it safe.
Save your "expertise" for your buddies at work.
I stand by the advice given to BE SAFE. You can disagree, I don't give a damn what you want to argue about... You are giving shitty advice to a new guy.
If some member of the general public that finds this discussion in a Google search after overheating their brass hurts themselves I hope you get sued. You can baffle the lawyers with how you're right without having seen the brass in question!
_________________ If it doesn't run on 2 wheels or a trigger... save your breath i'm, not listening.
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Fri Jun 18, 2021 4:08 pm |
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Yondering
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Location: Skagit County, in the woods Joined: Tue Apr 7, 2015 Posts: 1058
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harleyjasondavidson wrote: Not when alloyed with zinc it doesn't melt lower. And in NO case does it melt at 400 degrees!
This isn't a dick measuring contest dude. YOU are giving potentially dangerous advice with VERY little information from the OP, where I'm saying he should play it safe.
Save your "expertise" for your buddies at work.
I stand by the advice given to BE SAFE. You can disagree, I don't give a damn what you want to argue about... You are giving shitty advice to a new guy.
If some member of the general public that finds this discussion in a Google search after overheating their brass hurts themselves I hope you get sued. You can baffle the lawyers with how you're right without having seen the brass in question! Did you look at the link? Traditional WW alloy melts at 460 degrees F. That's pretty well known by anyone who casts with a thermometer, and matches my own experience with nearly 2,000 lb of bullets cast so far. Sure, that's higher than the 400 F you say your oven was set to, and it's no surprise that toaster oven temps aren't very accurate, but that's a long way off from the 600+ F you claimed or the even higher temps needed to anneal the brass. Alloyed with zinc? You really don't know anything about this, do you? You never want to mix zinc into the mix, it ruins the alloy for casting. You're the one throwing out bad information. I've given the OP numbers to consider to make a reasonable and informed decision, unlike your "I don't have a clue but you should take my advice and be safe". That's not good advice, it's just bad info. So far nothing you've said here has been based on any accurate info whatsoever, and your anectodal experiences all reflect bad assumptions, leading to bad conclusions. My beef is not with you in particular, or about making myself look better, but about how so many people jump in and give advice while knowing next to nothing about the subject and/or failing to apply any reason or logic to it. The OP jumped to the conclusion that color on the brass means it was overheated, and a bunch of you just followed that assumption without realizing that there's a much more likely and common cause. Anyone around here who's oven dried wet brass from tap water should have seen water staining cause color changes. It happens by drying brass even at just 200 F and has nothing to do with making brass dangerous to shoot. Besides that, the likelihood of causing temperature damage to brass is pretty low unless the OP is a complete idiot and set his oven to max temp, AND his oven runs way hotter than it should somehow.
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Fri Jun 18, 2021 9:16 pm |
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vic_b
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Location: Maple valley Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 Posts: 3528
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Cant we all just get along?
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Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:37 am |
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Pablo
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Location: Everson, WA Joined: Sun Jan 6, 2013 Posts: 28178
Real Name: Ace Winky
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vic_b wrote: Cant we all just get along? Silly thing to unzip and whip about. I do appreciate the metallurgical points made and knowledge needed for reloading. Scared? Gain knowledge. I will puke this up for discussion. With 45ACP even if the grain structure changed, which it didn't, what would happen if reloaded?
_________________ Why does the Penguin in Batman sound like a duck?
Because the eagle sounds like a hawk.
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Sat Jun 19, 2021 10:46 am |
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vic_b
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Location: Maple valley Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 Posts: 3528
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Pablo wrote: vic_b wrote: Cant we all just get along? Silly thing to unzip and whip about. I do appreciate the metallurgical points made and knowledge needed for reloading. Scared? Gain knowledge. I will puke this up for discussion. With 45ACP even if the grain structure changed, which it didn't, what would happen if reloaded? I’ve been reloading for close to 30 years. 45 acp for most of that. I’m new to wet tumbling and drying though. Ran some stupid hot loads with no problem. So we’ll see. These loads are fairly light with AA5.
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Sat Jun 19, 2021 2:00 pm |
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vic_b
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Location: Maple valley Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 Posts: 3528
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Loaded up a few of the brass and shot them one at a time, removing the mag. No problem.
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Thu Jun 24, 2021 2:38 pm |
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Yondering
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Location: Skagit County, in the woods Joined: Tue Apr 7, 2015 Posts: 1058
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vic_b wrote: Loaded up a few of the brass and shot them one at a time, removing the mag. No problem. Smart man; removing the mag is always wise if in doubt. As you probably know (but sharing here for those who don't), it can be the difference between a destroyed frame and a surprising but relatively minor puff of smoke. I'll admit it's saved me twice.
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Thu Jun 24, 2021 9:10 pm |
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vic_b
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Location: Maple valley Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2011 Posts: 3528
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Yondering wrote: vic_b wrote: Loaded up a few of the brass and shot them one at a time, removing the mag. No problem. Smart man; removing the mag is always wise if in doubt. As you probably know (but sharing here for those who don't), it can be the difference between a destroyed frame and a surprising but relatively minor puff of smoke. I'll admit it's saved me twice. I wasn't sure if it would help or not, just figured to give the brass someplace to go besides my face.
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Fri Jun 25, 2021 6:12 am |
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Yondering
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Location: Skagit County, in the woods Joined: Tue Apr 7, 2015 Posts: 1058
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Removing the mag gives the high pressure gas a place to vent if the case web blows out at the feed ramp (which is what could happen if you really had annealed your brass and used a hot enough load). It's more of a concern with high pressure rounds like the 40 S&W and 10mm; with the mag in the gun the gas can't escape fast enough, so it can build up pressure to burst the frame and/or grips. With no mag, it just vents through the big hole in the frame.
Obviously it's better to avoid loads that might do this in the first place, but removing the mag is a good safety measure when in doubt, and it really is effective.
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Fri Jun 25, 2021 12:09 pm |
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sportsdad60
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Location: The banana belt of MT Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2015 Posts: 8586
Real Name: Brian
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250 deg at 30 min with a toaster oven. My recipe for any brass except 50 cal. That dries over time, not in the oven.
_________________ "I hate to advocate drugs, alcohol, violence, or insanity to anyone, but they've always worked for me."- Hunter S. Thompson
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Wed Aug 18, 2021 3:49 pm |
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