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 Body armor 
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Location: Lynnwood and at large
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Real Name: Vick Lagina
Dropped by Esstac today with Joe (Puget Sound Firearms).
Joe dropped some standard capacity mags off to me. (We should have taken a selfie to send to Marco Liias!

Any way... Esstac. Great folks. Nice shop. Cutie-cutie. :inlove:

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Thu Mar 17, 2022 3:27 pm
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ViniVidivici wrote:
..... but if being shot at while you're prone, at much of a downward angle, you'll be badly exposed.

Helmets are not optional either, in that situation.



At prone i'd a assume it'd be a glancing blow. Probably a larger thinner plate might offer the same protection as a frontal with a straight on shot... It helps against fragmentation weapons, which i'm going to assume do lighter direct damage(mortars or grenades). Also thin armor can still really help spread out concussive damage.

I'm no expert, just doing some thinking here



A separate thing to consider here... There was a phenomenon in the 1600's, that helped kill the idea of armor... When a musket ball punched thru armor, sometimes it lost enough energy to play ping-pong off the back plate inside the body.


Thu Mar 17, 2022 8:04 pm
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Getting shot directly in the back is a thing too. I know of a guy who survived a "friendly" Iraqi doing just that to him. He wouldn't be here if not for those plates.

Nobody ever only wears a front plate, but a few folks do seem to prefer a bigger plate in back. Me, I dont see the point in that.

I'm no expert either, but I know folks who are, and which folks to listen to, and I do what they do.

And a modern ceramic/PE plate would provide nothing for a projectile to "bounce around" off of inside you, thankfully! But that might be yet another argument against using steel! HA!

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Thu Mar 17, 2022 10:56 pm
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How about "Beyond Level IV" armor?
Rated for tungsten core ammo. Lighter than lvl IV armor (+-6 lbs) and 1.1" thick?

https://www.ammoland.com/2022/03/adept- ... L_CAMPAIGN)#axzz7PGdmJHQ6

Image

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“Finding ‘common ground’ with the thinking of evil men is a fool’s errand” ~ Herschel Smith

"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~ Samuel Adams

“A return to First Principles in a Republic is sometimes caused by simple virtues of a single man. His good example has such an influence that the good men strive to imitate him, and the wicked are ashamed to lead a life so contrary to his example. Before all else, be armed!” ~ Niccolo Machiavelli

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FJB


Fri Apr 01, 2022 7:41 pm
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That does look interesting, but weight is an issue. 12-13 pounds of plates gets old real quick, and that’s not counting any of your extra kit. Price seems decent though


Fri Apr 01, 2022 8:22 pm
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Would a macbook be lighter?

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Mon Apr 04, 2022 9:03 pm
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chich627 wrote:

the real question is why arent there bulletproof macbook cases??


Tue Apr 05, 2022 8:35 pm
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For those interested, Esstac has a sale ok some of their Hesco plates. Helps save you a couple bucks, plus helps local business. Hesco’s are made in Aberdeen and are quality plates as well.
https://esstac.com/shop-all/armor/


Mon Apr 11, 2022 6:15 pm
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When I was in the Navy we found a bunch of old body armor (like 7 years out of manufacturer's specs). So instead of tossing it, we took it to the range and shot it. It stopped everything it was rated to stop. Body armor manufacturer's usually say its good for 5 years. We dug this out of an old conex box with no climate control. Old and cheap may be better than nothing.


Mon Jul 04, 2022 9:58 am
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:zombie:
They live!

Recent developments associated with the latest NIJ rating (NIJ 07RF2 - formerly III+) bring new considerations to the discussion.

III+ formerly had a bunch of wiggle room in the rating (as I understand it) but the NIJ 07 ratings require stopping 3 hits per plate.

RMA says it's stepped up and their III+/RF2 rated plates will stop M855A1 at 30 yards.

Hesco doesn't show any mention of the '07 standards yet.

Hesco 3600 series III+ plates weigh in at #4.9 and RMA's at a whopping #6.4.

Hesco also carries a price tag of 2x -ish of the RMA plates.

EDIT: From RMA website:

"What is RF2?

The upcoming standard set forth from the National Institute of Justice (NIJ) will implement a new ballistic rating system for hard and soft armor. When the new standards for armor are officially released, RF1 (Level III), RF2 (Level III+) and RF3 (Level IV) will be the hard armor names to replace the current ratings of Level III, Level IV, etc. (Level III+ was never an official compliance standard, previously).

But the differences in the ratings go far beyond the nomenclature. Under the current level III standard, a plate must defeat 6 rounds of M80 Steel while also boasting a back face deformation of less than 44mm. Because of that, many companies would rate their armor plates as Level III+ simply because it defeated what they personally deemed was a more threatening round than a M80 NATO Steel projectile. Many companies would say their plate could defeat a single round of m193, 7.62×39 msc or m855 and boast that their plate was a Level III+ or Level III++ despite the fact that their plates haven’t even been tested to defeat six (6) M80 NATO projectiles – the level III requirement.

However, under the new standard, RF1 plates (previously Level III) must now defeat three (3) M80 NATO Steel rounds, three (3) 7.62 x 39 msc AND three (3) m193 BT to earn its rating. If a plate cannot defeat those rounds while also boasting a BFD of less than 44mm, they will not even be considered for the RF2 rating (previously Level III+). So you MUST pass RF1 to have a chance to become an RF2 plate. Once the plate passes the RF1 testing, more plates must be submitted for further testing, which will also include defeating three (3) rounds of m855 as well.

At RMA, we have created this next generation plate that has not only passed RF1 and RF2 testing, but additionally defeats the m855a1 round. Here is the official RF1 and RF2 testing report for this plate. Going forward, a company will have to prove that they can defeat all of those rounds. And RMA is the first company to do so."



I wonder what conformance to the '07 standards will do to the weight and cost of the Hesco plates.

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“Finding ‘common ground’ with the thinking of evil men is a fool’s errand” ~ Herschel Smith

"The said Constitution shall never be construed to authorize Congress to prevent the people of the United States who are peaceable citizens from keeping their own arms." ~ Samuel Adams

“A return to First Principles in a Republic is sometimes caused by simple virtues of a single man. His good example has such an influence that the good men strive to imitate him, and the wicked are ashamed to lead a life so contrary to his example. Before all else, be armed!” ~ Niccolo Machiavelli

Láodòng zhèng zhūwèi zìyóu

FJB


Fri Jun 30, 2023 5:51 pm
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The only upgrade I would do with my HESCO’s is to get a set of multi curve plates, they’re the most comfortable option.

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Fri Jun 30, 2023 9:44 pm
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Two level IIIA soft ballistic plates in my EDC Vertx Transit Sling 2.0 bag.
I know, it’s not perfect, but it’s better, than nothing.
The whole load is 10 lbs.


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Sat Jul 01, 2023 4:20 am
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