Ebola in the states???

[kf7mjf]

[root]

You are right, projectile vomit would splash up behind a mask, but you know what? She likely would remember that...

Do you think she would remember mistakenly touching her wrist with gloves during decon, and then later rubbing the sweat from her brow with that now contaminated arm? Yeah....

So..... then it didn't happen and we are left with an open question?

Or she's lying because she's more worried about losing her job than anything else? (like dying, other people being infected etc)

I thought we were all supposed to be a group of well read and intelligent individuals? Not prone to scare tactics and fear mongering? Am I wrong in this? I can only assume I am. We sound like MDA after a shooting. JFC on a cracker.

So you blindly trust our government then? You are sure they always tell us the truth?

I'm not worrying about it turning into Walking Dead overnight. I'm worried about them thinking they know everything about this and have complete control of it from spreading further. We should be asking questions instead of being sheep that are just grazing and watching.

But of course, I don't know anything about medical protocols, let's listen to some other people who do:

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/10/ ... 6820141013

Did you bother to read anything I said? Ever?

I said, she likely broke protocol due to lack of proper training. Lots of places are guilty of this. It has nothing to do with the procedures though. If the procedures are followed, there is nil risk. Break procedure, you are likely going to have blood from your ass. She likely doesn't even realize HOW she broke protocol, even though it is obvious she did.

That article you posted, says as much as I did. Posters on the wall, training does not make.

As for the government... I cant believe it is YOU saying that to ME. The level of cognitive dissonance here is astounding. No I am not just believing what the"government says". Instead I actually payed attention in Biology 101 (Never mind biochem), and know how virus infections work. It isn't magic. I also don't just read media spin, unlike some.

[lamrith]

That everyone point root. People can and will make mistakes, and this bug is an nasty little fucker with no margin of error. Yet people are downplaying to severity of it now being on our shores.

Have we had verification yet on what gear the Dallas staff had on in each interaction with the initial patient? If not in full Ppv gear then procedure is pointless if he was projectile vomiting as particles will be in the air from that action, just like a sneeze would it not?

[ANZAC]

Did you bother to read anything I said? Ever?

I said, she likely broke protocol due to lack of proper training. Lots of places are guilty of this. It has nothing to do with the procedures though. If the procedures are followed, there is nil risk. Break procedure, you are likely going to have blood from your ass. She likely doesn't even realize HOW she broke protocol, even though it is obvious she did.

What if she correctly followed the training, but the equipment or procedure itself was inadequate? How can you dismiss those as possibilities?

As for the government... I cant believe it is YOU saying that to ME.

The level of cognitive dissonance here is astounding.

That's just easy to say when someone doesn't agree with you.

Let's see what a nurses association is saying about the equipment and procedures:

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2014/1 ... ared-ebola

I'm not going to post all the links, but there's about 20 different stories of health care professionals criticizing the CDC's statements that the nurse breached protocol without knowing what actually happened.

[ANZAC]

Have we had verification yet on what gear the Dallas staff had on in each interaction with the initial patient? If not in full Ppv gear then procedure is pointless if he was projectile vomiting as particles will be in the air from that action, just like a sneeze would it not?

Multiple stories are saying apron, mask, gloves. (presumably goggles too or a mask that includes eye protection)

[root]

Did you bother to read anything I said? Ever?

I said, she likely broke protocol due to lack of proper training. Lots of places are guilty of this. It has nothing to do with the procedures though. If the procedures are followed, there is nil risk. Break procedure, you are likely going to have blood from your ass. She likely doesn't even realize HOW she broke protocol, even though it is obvious she did.

What if she correctly followed the training, but the equipment or procedure itself was inadequate? How can you dismiss those as possibilities?

Because there would be a hell of a lot more people sick.

As for the government... I cant believe it is YOU saying that to ME.

The level of cognitive dissonance here is astounding.

That's just easy to say when someone doesn't agree with you.

Let's see what a nurses association is saying about the equipment and procedures:

http://www.commondreams.org/news/2014/1 ... ared-ebola

I'm not going to post all the links, but there's about 20 different stories of health care professionals criticizing the CDC's statements that the nurse breached protocol without knowing what actually happened.

[/quote]

No, I mean. One hand you say "Oh the government wont lie about 594 or its enforcement. Now you are saying it is lying about Ebola? Wat.

I have also said proper training in ALL infectious diseases is very much so lacking. Yes that is a problem, not Ebola itself.

[glockgirl]

...I believe the dog has already been euthanized...

The dog of the Spanish nurse's assistant in Madrid--the one who contracted Ebola whilst caring for an Ebola-infected dying Spanish priest whilst wearing little or no PPE--is the dog that was euthanised. Not aware of the nurse from Texas Presbyterian even having a dog, let alone it being put down. Dogs do serve as a reservoir of the Ebola virus, and although they do not develop the disease, the virus can be transmitted back to humans through contact with bodily fluids.

[CQBgopher]

Timeline----that can be found with a quick interwebz search of all the popular "media" sites...:

Sept 28---Duncan admitted to hospital with 103.1° fever, projectile vomiting, explosive diarrhea.
Sept 29---Duncan condition not improving, requested to be put into diapers.
Sept 30---Duncan's tests administered on Sept 28 come back from lab positive for this particular strain of "The Ebola"--then, and ONLY then, do the staff don the CDC "protocol required recommended gear" consisting of a mask, gloves, and aprons....or, as the "media" likes to put it, the "containment hazmat CDC full body PPE protective suit"


That's quite a lot of time for major exposure and possibility of direct contact with nastygrams of Duncan material containing an angry little bugwart.

Last edited by CQBgopher on Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:45 am, edited 1 time in total.

[ANZAC]

No, I mean. One hand you say "Oh the government wont lie about 594 or its enforcement. Now you are saying it is lying about Ebola? Wat.

My opinion is based on what they are saying, not who they are. Also, the CDC has a pretty crappy track record.
It didn't say they were lying, but more likely than the nurse to be lying.

So, you didn't answer my question. Didn't you read everything I wrote? You keep talking about training, yet you haven't said whether you think either the procedure or type of protective gear could be at fault? The CDCs position is, all of that is perfect therefore it was the nurses's fault.

[root]

No, I mean. One hand you say "Oh the government wont lie about 594 or its enforcement. Now you are saying it is lying about Ebola? Wat.

My opinion is based on what they are saying, not who they are. Also, the CDC has a pretty crappy track record.
It didn't say they were lying, but more likely than the nurse to be lying.

So, you didn't answer my question. Didn't you read everything I wrote? You keep talking about training, yet you haven't said whether you think either the procedure or type of protective gear could be at fault? The CDCs position is, all of that is perfect therefore it was the nurses's fault.

No, she fucked up plain and simple. If the procedure was bad, other people would be sick. Occam's razor. Pretty simple shit.

[ANZAC]

Timeline----that can be found with a quick interwebz search of all the popular "media" sites...:

Sept 28---Duncan admitted to hospital with 103.1° fever, projectile vomiting, explosive diarrhea.
Sept 29---Duncan condition not improving, requested to be put into diapers.
Sept 30---Duncan's tests administered on Sept 28 come back from lab positive for this particular strain of "The Ebola"--then, and ONLY then, do the staff don the CDC "protocol required recommended gear" consisting of a mask, gloves, and aprons....or, as the "media" likes to put it, the "containment hazmat CDC full body PPE protective suit"


That's quite a lot of time for major exposure and possibility of direct contact with nastygrams of Duncan material containing an angry little bugwart.

The timeline I've seen says the hospital staff were wearing mask, gloves, aprons on Sep 28.

[CQBgopher]

No, I mean. One hand you say "Oh the government wont lie about 594 or its enforcement. Now you are saying it is lying about Ebola? Wat.

My opinion is based on what they are saying, not who they are. Also, the CDC has a pretty crappy track record.
It didn't say they were lying, but more likely than the nurse to be lying.

So, you didn't answer my question. Didn't you read everything I wrote? You keep talking about training, yet you haven't said whether you think either the procedure or type of protective gear could be at fault? The CDCs position is, all of that is perfect therefore it was the nurses's fault.

Based on your logic, since there are no instructions on a package of toilet paper, people must be getting poo all over their fingers every time they go #2 since nobody has spoon fed them the correct information on how to use The Charmin...they just squeeze it and giggle since that's what the commercial shows....

CDC's and anybody else's "protocol" is only as strong as the weakest link. glockgirl kinda hit that nail into the board already.

Last edited by CQBgopher on Mon Oct 13, 2014 8:48 am, edited 1 time in total.

[ANZAC]

No, I mean. One hand you say "Oh the government wont lie about 594 or its enforcement. Now you are saying it is lying about Ebola? Wat.

My opinion is based on what they are saying, not who they are. Also, the CDC has a pretty crappy track record.
It didn't say they were lying, but more likely than the nurse to be lying.

So, you didn't answer my question. Didn't you read everything I wrote? You keep talking about training, yet you haven't said whether you think either the procedure or type of protective gear could be at fault? The CDCs position is, all of that is perfect therefore it was the nurses's fault.

No, she fucked up plain and simple. If the procedure was bad, other people would be sick. Occam's razor. Pretty simple shit.

Actually the CDC has already said, if other health care providers become sick, they must also have not followed the protocol.
They've pre-blamed them, even if another 10 people get sick.

If the procedure or equipment is bad, it just means the risk is elevated. It doesn't mean everyone will get sick.

[ANZAC]

CDC's and anybody else's "protocol" is only as strong as the weakest link. glockgirl kinda hit that nail into the board already.

So, again, you are saying their procedure and the equipment level they recommend is perfect and there is 0 chance of infection if the procedure is followed to the letter?

The nurses association link I posted above say they think the level of equipment is inadequate.

[CQBgopher]

CDC's and anybody else's "protocol" is only as strong as the weakest link. glockgirl kinda hit that nail into the board already.

So, again, you are saying their procedure and the equipment level they recommend is perfect and there is 0 chance of infection if the procedure is followed to the letter?

The nurses association link I posted above say they think the level of equipment is inadequate.

You're a smart man. Are you going to walk into a room in Dallas, Texas where a guy from Liberia has a 103.1° fever, projectile vomiting, and explosive diarrhea, in a pair of nitrile gloves, UVEX goggles, and a Tyvek apron, because that's "protocol"?

Guess what I'm trying to say is.......if people don't use their brains and stop relying on a pamphlet and a dog & pony show and instead use common freakin' sense......ya, nothing good will happen.

This virus has been around for a long, long time, and has been contained for the most part in a 3rd world country with a lot less to work with than we have here. By the CDC, WHO, and others. I'm not blind enough to not see that the new age of a computer box telling people what to do coincides with this latest little fiasco of stupidity, and when otherwise intelligent people like yourself lean on that reasoning it validates my worst fears.

People really have gotten dumber.