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RENCORP wrote:Send Anzac to Texas.

They deserve each other.

And, he is an expert on both 594, and Ebola, so they need him down there in that diseased armed camp of unregulated gun owners.

i just solved three first world problems.

Send money, please.

Nah, the gun laws in Texas are too onerous.

A friend of mine in Dallas lives a block from the nurse's apartment....

ANZAC wrote:

RENCORP wrote:Send Anzac to Texas.

They deserve each other.

And, he is an expert on both 594, and Ebola, so they need him down there in that diseased armed camp of unregulated gun owners.

i just solved three first world problems.

Send money, please.

Nah, the gun laws in Texas are too onerous.

A friend of mine in Dallas lives a block from the nurse's apartment....

I wouldn't open any of his mail he sends you....he licked the envelope.

....stamps are selfsticky

Im just going to leave this here

http://www.cidrap.umn.edu/news-perspect ... tion-ebola

Is Ebola an aerosol-transmissible disease?

We recently published a commentary on the CIDRAP site discussing whether Middle East respiratory syndrome (MERS) could be an aerosol-transmissible disease, especially in healthcare settings. We drew comparisons with a similar and more well-studied disease, severe acute respiratory syndrome (SARS).

For Ebola and other filoviruses, however, there is much less information and research on disease transmission and survival, especially in healthcare settings.

Being at first skeptical that Ebola virus could be an aerosol-transmissible disease, we are now persuaded by a review of experimental and epidemiologic data that this might be an important feature of disease transmission, particularly in healthcare settings.

Hrmmm... Nothing to worry about our Protocols in the US are the best in the world, no way Ebola will spread.

Texas dept.: 2nd person tests positive for Ebola

Dallas nurses describe Ebola hospital care: 'There was no protocol'

lamrith wrote:Hrmmm... Nothing to worry about our Protocols in the US are the best in the world, no way Ebola will spread.

Texas dept.: 2nd person tests positive for Ebola

Dallas nurses describe Ebola hospital care: 'There was no protocol'

While I hate fear mongering of the media, it is shit like this that makes me not want to leave the house.

It now appears, along with the revelation that a second "healthcare worker" (who could be anything from a janitor to a doctor), that Texas Presbyterian had extremely sloppy isolation protocols in place when Mr. Duncan was admitted and may not even had appropriate basic isolation PPE available for use by staff. It's not even that they didn't have an "Ebola protocol" in place--only a handful of hospitals really did--they didn't have anything approaching standard isolation protocol in place at all. SMH.

I would be very interested in knowing the number of nosocomial infections per year originating at Texas Presbyterian, because this is for sure not the first time a staff member has either acquired an infection from a patient in isolation or transmitted an infection to another patient or patients--but of course, hospitals are not required to make that information public. As a nurse, you accept the risks that come with the job--accidental needle sticks, the possibility of acquiring a virus like cytomegalovirus (CMV) when pregnant, the very real possibility of being physically assaulted by a patient--but you also expect that your employer will provide you with the necessary equipment to protect yourself (well, except for against the whole assault thing).

I now sincerely hope that Texas Presbyterian is brought up on criminal negligence charges, as well as facing civil suits and worker's compensation claims from those infected.

glockgirl wrote:As root and I have both said, this is not some super virus that can penetrate nitrile gloves, and if there was some overall failure in the PPE itself, then we would see several, if not all, of the providers who attended to Mr. Duncan fall ill themselves. Occam's Razor dictates that the simplest answer is usually the correct one, and the simplest answer here is accidental self-inoculation with the virus during the removal of the PPE.

I just wanted to requote your post.

I am sure the CDC will just blame the 2nd worker. Because the process, procedure and protocol is fine. These people just breached it, right?

Two people out out three hundred some odd million in this country come down with a disease, and everybody loses their shit... Meanwhile over one hundred die per day in car wrecks and nobody blinks.

Some new CDC quotes:

Dr. Tom Frieden, head of the CDC, has acknowledged that the government wasn't aggressive enough in managing Ebola and containing the virus as it spread from an infected patient to a nurse at a Dallas hospital.

"We could've sent a more robust hospital infection control team and been more hands-on with the hospital from day one about exactly how this should be managed," he said Tuesday.

"Frieden outlined new steps this week designed to stop the spread of the disease, including the creation of an Ebola response team, increased training for health care workers nationwide and changes at the Texas hospital to minimize the risk of more infections.

"I wish we had put a team like this on the ground the day the patient - the first patient - was diagnosed. That might have prevented this infection," Frieden said.

glockgirl wrote:It now appears, along with the revelation that a second "healthcare worker" (who could be anything from a janitor to a doctor), that Texas Presbyterian had extremely sloppy isolation protocols in place when Mr. Duncan was admitted and may not even had appropriate basic isolation PPE available for use by staff. It's not even that they didn't have an "Ebola protocol" in place--only a handful of hospitals really did--they didn't have anything approaching standard isolation protocol in place at all. SMH.

I would be very interested in knowing the number of nosocomial infections per year originating at Texas Presbyterian, because this is for sure not the first time a staff member has either acquired an infection from a patient in isolation or transmitted an infection to another patient or patients--but of course, hospitals are not required to make that information public. As a nurse, you accept the risks that come with the job--accidental needle sticks, the possibility of acquiring a virus like cytomegalovirus (CMV) when pregnant, the very real possibility of being physically assaulted by a patient--but you also expect that your employer will provide you with the necessary equipment to protect yourself (well, except for against the whole assault thing).

I now sincerely hope that Texas Presbyterian is brought up on criminal negligence charges, as well as facing civil suits and worker's compensation claims from those infected.

Glockgirl,
I admire your courage and willingness to work with these sort of patients and the risks you take to perform your chosen occupation on a daily basis.

This sort of thing is what has concerned me the most about this situation, I do not think Texas Presbyterian is by any means the only hospital in this situation. I will admit I have no hard data, but I have a feeling that if a detailed survey/research was done less than 50% of the hospitals in this country are currently equipped to handle this sort of isolation requirement. If for no other reason than the fact that until now, it has not been an issue for concern, as diseases like this have not been in the country. That does not even touch the issue of the millions of Dr offices and urgent care clinics that will not have the proper equipment. Now we will see billions spent by US hospitals rushing to gear and more fully train up. Not a bad thing, but betting we will see a eventual increase in medical costs as well.

I do not agree that they should be held liable or sued for this (yet). Our own CDC has not been pro-active in working with our customs/immigration agencies to put effective entry screening in place until after the fact. Until now there has been little reason for US healthcare workers to have concern for aggressive screening for this disease, that is not the fault of the hospital or negligent on their part. We have had little risk of diseases of this type in the US to drive such aggressive protocols to all levels of healthcare. Now moving forward, say a few months to a year from now, sure I would agree completely that hospitals should be held accountable as it now IS a cause for concern and requires proper protocols in place in all hospitals in the US.

The other link to this chain is how/when the diagnosis occurs and what are the procedures before that and after that. Post diagnosis protocols only go so far. Can or do we really expect every flu patient to be received with full isolation protocols? It is just not a realistic expectation and that should be reason for concern for everyone. The infected person is going to come in and be in waiting rooms until a initial screening/questionare is done before any staff member knows that they have enough indicators to warrant isolation and testing. That means exposure to those in the waiting room and staff there as well. The protocols for handling those aspects are what really need to be addressed.

I am curious and hoping one of you more knowledgeable of Ebola can fill me in on the basic timeline for the disease? Namely the time between when a patient becomes infected to the time they are infectious to others.
It would be interesting to lay that timeline down on this 1st patient to see possible exposure to others prior to his isolation. Was he already infectious when he came to the hospital on Sept 28th and was then sent home? That should be the strong focus right now, where he was and everyplace he went and touched and who was in those rooms at the time and afterwards. I would hope CDC has already done this as well, but...

kf7mjf wrote:Two people out out three hundred some odd million in this country come down with a disease, and everybody loses their shit... Meanwhile over one hundred die per day in car wrecks and nobody blinks.

It is about 91/day but who's counting...

I'm not worried it is going to get in my house, my kid's schools etc. It is just interesting to watch the arrogance of the government, the health care professionals, who said there was no risk in bringing ebola patients to the US. I know that these infections are from treating a walk in, and not one of the people they transported.

Here are some reassuring quotes from the CDC from when the first case was deliberately brought here:

"We're stopping it in its tracks in this country," Thomas Frieden, director of the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, declared during a news conference Tuesday afternoon.

People keep bringing up Occam's Razor as proof that there is no big risk or concern. However as we all know not all people contract an illness even when exposed. There are always those that have a resistance. Saying just because not everyone there is infected is not proof that there is/was not an issue or that widespread exposure did not happen.

Plus the onset of symptoms for Ebola from what I am seeing ranges from 2days to three weeks with death 6 to 16days after onset of symptoms, so we have a about a month to wait and see if any other patients show up with symptoms to know for sure. The weeks ahead will tell us just how much exposure there may have been. Hopefully everyone in that waiting room on Sept28th and since is being tested for infection.

AWWW Shit!

Apparently she was in Cleveland and took a flight back to Dallas the day before she was diagnosed.......

http://thescoopblog.dallasnews.com/2014 ... onms.html/

A bit more on training, CDC protocols training, and levels of PPE:
http://www.boston.com/health/2014/10/14 ... story.html

ANZAC wrote:

glockgirl wrote:As root and I have both said, this is not some super virus that can penetrate nitrile gloves, and if there was some overall failure in the PPE itself, then we would see several, if not all, of the providers who attended to Mr. Duncan fall ill themselves. Occam's Razor dictates that the simplest answer is usually the correct one, and the simplest answer here is accidental self-inoculation with the virus during the removal of the PPE.

I just wanted to requote your post.

I am sure the CDC will just blame the 2nd worker. Because the process, procedure and protocol is fine. These people just breached it, right?

JFC. BECAUSE SHE DID. Fuck man. Do you even bother reading?

The hospital did not have proper training in place. These people fucked up.

Go vomit up more media bullshit. It seems that you are the expert on such things. I am sure you have the proper training and certification to handle such things. I defer to your expert opinions. Not the people who have worked in biolab environments, they don't know shit.

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