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US Civil War.

kf7mjf wrote:US Civil War.

interesting. I used to really be into the civil war bust must have missed that little nugget. Maybe I just need to travel more and get to more battlefields.

It's amazing that we still have poor relations with Russia. The country has become conservative yet the USA is now becoming more and more liberal.

During Czar times Russia and USA were on good terms. Hell there are Remington made Mosins.... Then there was communism which ruined the relationship. After the fall of Soviet Union though Russia has been moving more and more toward conservative politics. Why we still have Russophobia is beyond me...

joao01 wrote:

kf7mjf wrote:US Civil War.

interesting. I used to really be into the civil war bust must have missed that little nugget. Maybe I just need to travel more and get to more battlefields.

Nah, visiting battlefields won't help.

In this case, as I'm sure you know, the US was concerned England and France would diplomatically recognize the CSA, and were trying to prevent that. Fortunately, Davis wasn't as keen on foreign relations as Lincoln was. However, there were several big pushes in France and England to intervene for/recognize the CSA. One big giant 800 pound gorilla looming in the background was the close friendship between the US and Russia, and Prussia's good relations with the US. If England and France were to intervene on behalf of the CSA, then it could have literally triggered a global war, with Russia, the US and Prussia fighting England and France, and possibly some of their allies.

Remember, this was still when the Crimean War was recent memory, and Europe was at it's normal state of uneasy peace. It wouldn't take much to set things off again. When the 1863 crisis in Poland took place, Russia deployed it's Baltic fleet to New York and San Francisco, in order to keep them out of the icebound Baltic and the reach of superior British shipping.

Historians debate the true meaning of Russia's actions. Some see it as a selfish gesture taking advantage of the Civil War to place a vulnerable fleet in a safe position and to better place it for commerce raiding in the event of hostilities between Russia, England and France. Others note this point of view started to develop in the early 20th Century and smacks of revisionism. I think the truth is somewhere in the middle, with Russia moving it's chess pieces about the giant global chessboard and upping the ante in case of war with France and England, and as a side bonus, ensuring favorable relations with an ally, and forcing France and England to change their behavior towards that ally. It certainly was a win all around. Russia got a safe harbor for it's Baltic Fleet, the US got a strong domestic boost at home, and now had the risk of increased CS/England/France relations weakened.

Here are two articles that present differing views on the subject. No matter which view you hold, it cannot be denied that Russia's movements sent a powerful message to England and France at a time when it was desirable to have them stay out of US affairs.

http://www.loyno.edu/~history/journal/1 ... lehaye.htm

http://www.voltairenet.org/article169488.html

kf7mjf wrote:
Nah, visiting battlefields won't help.

Helps me not be here in WA, and Battlefields are fun with the right crowd. I once toured Ghettysburg with college professors. Walking the same terrain as Pickett, etc really gives you an appreciation for history.

Even visiting an 1812 Battlefield was fun without anyone "narrating". mediocre beer though. Great food nearby.

"Man, those British sure kicked some ass in Washington DC didn't they? I bet after they burned the city, they got wasted on hard cider and found a bunch of hot ass mulatto hookers to hammer."

joao01 wrote:

kf7mjf wrote:Nah, visiting battlefields won't help.

Helps me not be here in WA, and Battlefields are fun with the right crowd. I once toured Ghettysburg with college professors. Walking the same terrain as Pickett, etc really gives you an appreciation for history.

Even visiting an 1812 Battlefield was fun without anyone "narrating". mediocre beer though. Great food nearby.

I used to live in a plantation house that was involved in Antietam. I couldn't walk 50 feet without kicking bullets under foot... It was considered a national historic area or some such nonsense....couldn't dig anywhere... had to have a permit just to use a metal detector... on 'private property'... Cool as all hell.... except on those cool fall nights when the fog would roll in... you could almost imagine the troops marching through...hear cannon fire in the distance...screams of dying men.... creeped me out, even as a teenager...

I'd take Antietam over Gettysburg any day...

gonna be the biggest april fools joke.

Rusoarmo wrote:It's amazing that we still have poor relations with Russia. The country has become conservative yet the USA is now becoming more and more liberal.

During Czar times Russia and USA were on good terms. Hell there are Remington made Mosins.... Then there was communism which ruined the relationship. After the fall of Soviet Union though Russia has been moving more and more toward conservative politics. Why we still have Russophobia is beyond me...

Seemed less tense during the W. Bush Administration and ever since Obama has been in office the vibe from most every world leader is they don't respect him, and Putin seems to be one of the more obvious ones.

Russia's current political and economic situation is a lot like small town USA. Cronyism, greased palms, etc. Very similar to the way much of the US operates without the smoke n mirrors.

cmica wrote:

timmytowbowman wrote:Probably on a romantic get away with Obama

hope they get into a shooting contest

timmytowbowman wrote:

cmica wrote:

timmytowbowman wrote:Probably on a romantic get away with Obama

hope they get into a shooting contest

My money is on Putin.

I would pay a lot of money to watch Putin and Obama do 12 rounds in a steel cage.

He's alive!!! ‘It’s boring without rumors’: Putin appears in public after week of MSM hysteria




Sent from my UAV using Disposition Matrix 2.0

Rusoarmo wrote:It's amazing that we still have poor relations with Russia. The country has become conservative yet the USA is now becoming more and more liberal.

During Czar times Russia and USA were on good terms. Hell there are Remington made Mosins.... Then there was communism which ruined the relationship. After the fall of Soviet Union though Russia has been moving more and more toward conservative politics. Why we still have Russophobia is beyond me...

Russia always was more conservative than the US.

solyanik wrote:

Rusoarmo wrote:It's amazing that we still have poor relations with Russia. The country has become conservative yet the USA is now becoming more and more liberal.

During Czar times Russia and USA were on good terms. Hell there are Remington made Mosins.... Then there was communism which ruined the relationship. After the fall of Soviet Union though Russia has been moving more and more toward conservative politics. Why we still have Russophobia is beyond me...

Russia always was more conservative than the US.

Besides the whole communist thing?

In terms of culture/people I think it's definitely on par with "small town" or "southern". Many are self reliant, not fond of homosexuals and "old school" when it comes to their daughters.

http://www.loyno.edu/~history/journal/1 ... lehaye.htm

http://www.voltairenet.org/article169488.html

Thanks for posting. I remember decades ago when this was mentioned but never explained in school.